Finish Lines & Milestones: Episode 157: Noa Besner - Paces & Places

Finish Lines & Milestones: Episode 157: Noa Besner - Paces & Places

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Guest: Noa Besner @paces.places @neverstoppingnoa

Show Notes:

Noa Bessner and I actually met in person at the Indianapolis Monumental Marathon shakeout run last fall — and I'm so glad we finally sat down to record together. Noa is a New York City-based runner, run coach, and co-founder of Paces & Places, a new travel company bringing small groups of runners to international races.

During this episode, sponsored by Batch, we talk about:

  • How Noa decided early on in life to live within one mile of Central Park (a hard rule, apparently)
  • Getting into running completely by accident at 25 — skipping gym class courtesy of a mom-written note, then doing a charity half marathon when a friend got injured
  • Her first marathon: Nashville, 95 degrees, hilly, and a complete struggle bus — and why it made her want to do another one immediately
  • Going from a 5:32 at Nashville to a 3:26 PR and then breaking that at Rotterdam Marathon (Marathon #22!) 🎉
  • What actually moved the needle: cross training, strength work, recovery, getting a coach, and building a real mental game
  • Coaching for New York Road Runners — and how it's a full circle moment from when she was Level 1 of 20 in one of their beginner groups
  • The philosophy behind keeping her coaching roster small and truly customizing plans around her athletes' lives
  • The time she ran Vancouver with a broken leg and didn't know it (whoops)
  • Her approach to racing for time vs. racing for experience — and how not every race needs to be a PR
  • Prep habits for time-goal races: driving the entire course, watching ride-along videos, memorizing every hill
  • Her 26 mantras — one per mile — including Mile 18 which is always "shut up buttercup" 😂
  • Paces & Places: the small group international race travel company she co-founded with Shannon and Jess
  • Their first trip: the Midnight Sun Marathon in Tromsø, Norway — Arctic Circle, 8:30 PM start, 24-hour daylight, sauna + North Sea plunge included
  • The Lochness Marathon in the Scottish Highlands: bagpipes at the start, Nessie plushies everywhere, stunning fall colors, and a bus ride to the top of a mountain
  • Why she only brings groups to races she's personally tested and loved
  • Racing internationally: jet lag strategy, food allergies and navigating Tokyo's sesame situation, Google Translate as a bestie
  • The NYC Marathon cancellation during Hurricane Sandy — she was at the expo holding a jacket she had to put back
  • Her NYC Marathon Day spectating strategy involving approximately 47 items crammed into her pockets and not getting spit at as a measure of success
  • Having a BQ rejected by 20 seconds despite qualifying by 3+ minutes 😭
  • Why the BQ itself felt more meaningful than running Boston
  • Marathon taglines — and workshopping a better one for Indianapolis 👀

Previous Guests Mentioned

Sponsor Details

  • Batch - Use code FINISH for 30% off sitewide

Other Links

This is a SandyBoy Productions podcast.

Episode Transcript

[00:00:00] This is a Sandy Boy Productions podcast

Noa: I go very detailed. I will watch the ride along videos. I will note every single hill. I will know the elevation. I have made my friends drive me through the entire course Welcome to Finish Lines and Milestones, a podcast for everyday runners. I'm your host, ally Brett knocker, and if you run, you are a runner and every runner has a story. Join me each week as I share these stories and we celebrate finish lines and milestones together.

Ally: Okay. This episode is brought to you by batch, and I wanna be upfront that I'm just getting started with them. So I'll be reporting back as I go, but here is why I said yes to the partnership. Batch is a hemp wellness brand founded by an actual chemical engineer out of Wisconsin. Not influencers, not marketers, people who care about what's in the product You can look up exactly what's in every single thing that they make. So here are the three things I'm personally starting with. They have micro mints, nighttime gummies, and the pet C, B, D for my dog. The micro mints are C, B, D and C, BG blend that dissolve under your tongue.

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And then the pet, CBDI got for my 12-year-old dog, Doug, his groomer recommended, including CB, D, in his routine when he is gonna get groomed because he has arthritis, he's getting a little [00:02:00] anxious as an old man. So they have that available for your furry friends as well. Right now batch is offering a whopping 30% off sitewide.

And yes, that applies to subscriptions too, so you can lock in that discount on your monthly supply. Go to hello batch.com/finish. and use code Finish at checkout. Thank you batch for supporting this podcast.

And now for this week's episode, I got to interview Noa Bessner. She is the founder of Paces and Places. She is a run coach, a runner, a. She's based in New York City. I actually had a chance to meet her in person at the Indie Monumental last year. She came in town and she ran the half. She was also at Lindsay Heine and I's live event.

So speaking of quick plug for anybody in Indie who's running the Indie Mini, or anybody coming in town, I'm hosting a live event with Lindsay Heine and Emma Grace Hurley. On May 1st, there will be details and a link to tickets in the show notes. So go check that out. Noa and I chatted about her running journey. We talked about how she got into it really with Leukemia Lymphoma Society, which is now [00:03:00] Blood Cancer United. A quick plug two for Carly Trula Quinn's campaign that is going on right now through May 8th.

Check that out in the show notes, but Noa got into the sport with fundraising, because she had a friend who got injured. So that's kind of what started it all for her. And her first marathon was in Nashville Tennis sea. It was 95 degrees. Actually, her first two marathons were really brutal. Kind of wonder how she continues to do it.

But we, talk all about. Some really cool places that she's run and really what inspired her to start paces and places. They have a couple of trips this year, one to Norway that's about to close, and then another one to Scotland later this year. So you'll have to check that out. it sounds like such a dream.

So I love what she's doing there. And then for everybody in Indy, she's coming back this fall to run, monumental the marathon. So we'll have her back in town then, and I can't wait to see her in person again. And also I forgot to ask her the end of the podcast questions, so I got to ask her about the marathon.

She just ran in Rotterdam, so we got a full update on that at the end of this episode. So stick around for that and I hope you enjoy my conversation with Noa.

I think we're here. I think we did it.

Noa: [00:04:00] we did it. We are here.

Ally: It is so good to see you.

Noa: it's so good to see you. You can't fully see my shirt, but now you could kind of see I'm wearing an Indiana shirt in your Honor

Ally: That is

Noa: to mark the state where you live, but obviously where we also met a few months ago

Ally: Just a short few. Gosh, it's probably been like six months now.

Noa: isn't crazy.

Ally: Yeah, it's crazy. Yeah. I'm so glad you came to Indy. remind me, was it your first time in

Noa: Yeah, first time

Ally: and what did you think

Noa: I loved it. It was such a great race weekend and we're coming back this November, so I think that means it was a five star experience.

Ally: Perfect. Oh, that's great news. I am hearing we're gonna sell out sooner than we ever have, so I'm

Noa: I signed off on January 1st, so that marketing worked. Coming for my redemption marathon there since I didn't get to run it last time.

Ally: Oh, nice. So did you run the half then

Noa: ran the half with Nicole, who you met with me. Yeah. So it was super fun. I always say, if you can't fully race, how can you use the race in a different way? And to me, racing with her and getting her a PR was very fun. Maybe not fun for her in the [00:05:00] very last half mile where I made the girls sprint, but she was happy with me afterwards and that's what matters

Ally: Oh, yay. Well, congratulations to Nicole.

Noa: exactly.

Ally: fun. I love though, Noa, how I can't wait to talk to you about how not every race has to be a pr. I love your mindset there, I so agree with that. So we'll, dig in there, but first, tell people where you are

Noa: Yes, I'm in New York. I've been here forever, so, hi. From the Upper West side in New York.

Ally: So in New York. New

Noa: Yes.

Ally: York proper. Oh, so amazing. I ran New York 2018. Been a long time, and that was the last time maybe I've been in the city, which is sad.

Noa: Gotta, you gotta come visit. I sandwich myself between the Hudson Rivers, the West Side Highway for running, and I like to be within one mile of Central Park. That actually is a rule for my living just to be close to both running places.

Ally: What a dream are you from there?

Noa: Uh, I grew up in New Jersey, born in Israel, grew up in New Jersey. I add the Israel to add a little bit of spin to New Jersey, high New Jersey people.

[00:06:00] But you know, I need a little extra flair. I've been in the city since college on.

Ally: Amazing. and you came to good old Indiana. I love it. Love it when people from big cities or like either coast come to Indy because usually people have never been, they've either driven through or they flew over the state and I just think, you know, it has more to offer than people typically expect.

There's more than corn in Indiana is, was a

Noa: Yeah,

Ally: point.

Noa: I found everyone super friendly. It was a nice place to run. Great cheer energy, honestly. Great weather. So that really brought Nicole and I there. And I hope we have that again this year and a good, flat, fast course and then plenty of stuff to do. So we'll be back to explore more.

Ally: Hooray. And you came to the shakeout run that

Noa: Yeah.

Ally: hosted with myself and our local running store, athletic Annex. And did you stay at Bottleworks? Where did you stay when you were in town?

Noa: I'm forgetting the name of the hotel, but we stayed close to the expo in the start line.

Ally: Okay, so like probably Weston or there's a

Noa: One of those, yeah.

Ally: Omni. You're like, I don't know, travel enough. well [00:07:00] I can't wait to have you guys back because Lindsay, and I'll probably do a shakeout run and we'll do an event

Noa: We will be there. Yeah. And we came to that finale event, so we'll, we'll do it all again.

Ally: did? I didn't even get a chance to talk to you

Noa: It was so busy there. And you guys were the stars wearing your silver. I remember silver in sequence. I think you had a cool puffer. So we'll be back. But it was great to meet you too. And that's what it was about. It was like a big marathon, but like.

Local energy and meeting you and meeting Lindsay and other people in that shakeout really gave us like that hometown feel that we look for. I love running in New York. I love raising here. We'll get into that.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: there are other fall races and really what I'm trying to explore with all the things I do.

Ally: Oh yes, others do exist. alright, what were your, what will your goals look like for this year as a redemption race for you?

Noa: well first I have to get through my next marathon, which is in a week, so

Ally: Cool. Okay.

Noa: will do that first. Yes, I'm off. I'm off to Europe to run Rotterdam on April 12th

Ally: Amazing.

Noa: yeah, it's supposed to be a fast one,

Ally: Okay.

Noa: this year they doubled the field size field [00:08:00] and a later start. So we'll see what happens. But I like to say we can only control the controllables, so I feel like I've done the best I can through the most insane winter.

I dunno how it was on your end, but New York was insane, so

Ally: that

Noa: it

Ally: We didn't get as much snow as you got

Noa: was rough and I ran more. Like speed workouts on the treadmill and had to adjust runs more than usual. But to all of those out there that have run through this winter, honestly, I'm just going in being like I trained through it. I could have not, and it'll be the best it can be, but I feel pretty good going into it.

Yeah,

Ally: Okay. Uh, where is Rotterdam? I should know.

Noa: no, I honestly didn't know until I started trekking this race. So it's known less by Americans, but it is a world record race. It is in the Netherlands and about 45 minutes north of Amsterdam,

Ally: Okay.

Noa: not too far out of there. So the big Amsterdam marathon is in the fall, and then this is their big Netherlands race in the spring.

Ally: So have you been to the Netherlands

Noa: never been, so a fun thing I do with travel is discover [00:09:00] new places. So all I know is that when I think of the Netherlands, I think flat. So it's flat, which is nice.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: Hopefully some good weather and then I'll make it into a vacation after that.

Ally: Excellent. And so are there tulips there? Better be tulips. That's what I think

Noa: Yeah, this, the main festival is like now in April. So I'll do my Rotterdam race weekend and then we'll go exploring. I'm gonna do some kayaking in the canals. I'm gonna make some stroop waffles from scratch 'cause that sounded fun.

Ally: heck

Noa: And I'll eat a ton more and then I'll go see the tulips and hang out.

Ally: Wow, that's so amazing. So I love this, again, the idea that not every race has to be a pr, and also the idea of exploration using races. Like, Hey, I wanna go here. When is there a race? Kind of a concept. And now you've built, you're building a business around that too, which we'll talk about, but how many countries have you run in so

Noa: Okay. I should know that and I don't. But a good amount. This will be Marathon 22, and hopefully a pr, but if not, we'll explore and enjoy anyways.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: [00:10:00] started, I think my. Third marathon was already international out in Vancouver, and I just loved like going and exploring and having a really cool destination to go to.

Ally: Wow. And that one's Vancouver's Hilly. Is that right?

Noa: it is. That has the main bridge. It's really pretty, but it has a giant bridge, which after you get over you're like, yay, it's done. And then you turn around and you do it again because that's cute.

Ally: Oh,

Noa: Yeah.

Ally: cute. Okay,

Noa: Yeah.

Ally: very first marathon? Was it New York?

Noa: Okay. It was Nashville, so I was not a runner at all. I got into running at 25 like at all. I skipped gym class 'cause my mom was a teacher and wrote me a note, which looking back like that is ridiculous and I'm so sporty now,

Ally: mom.

Noa: also really nice.

All I did was have to perform one jazz number, which I am not a dancer, but I performed one jazz number. and I got into it later in life when one of my best friends was training for half marathon for charity and she got injured. I'm like, I'll do it. What's the big deal? So I kind of got into it

Ally: Wow.

Noa: haphazardly through that charity for leukemia lymphoma and for the [00:11:00] choices that spring, it was New Jersey close or go to Nashville for the country music marathon.

And that sounded fun. So I don't even love country music, but that sounded amazing. And then I got there, Allie, and it was 95 degrees. It was 95 degrees and it was hilly. We all did it. The whole team did it. But, struggle bus.

Ally: I'm surprised they didn't black flag that. That's

Noa: I can't, you know, this is when it's like, I haven't been in it that long, but 15 years ago, or whenever it was, 2007, I wanna say 2008, they weren't canceling as much.

That same race had a lot of issues. The year after, it had thunderstorms, but they didn't cancel right away. They canceled mid race and then a different year they had to cancel for heat. So it's just that time of the year in April, may down there.

Ally: is brutal. That is warm. That is a

Noa: Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Ally: time

Noa: Yeah. So I think I thought it would be one and done, but it was such an insane experience that I needed another one.

Ally: made you wanna do it again after that Insane experience?

Noa: I think it was that I learned to run with people. So my friend Sarah [00:12:00] and I learned to run 20 minutes around this little turtle pond, literally where turtles play, that's how big it is. Not very big to spits a few turtles, and we learned how to run 20 minutes. And then in a few months, I joined this charity team and kind of got that hang of it and running with her, and then really running with the group and meeting people and finding that community.

I kind of enjoyed that lifestyle. I was like, let me give it a try. I was super slow. It was very difficult. I have no genetic talents for the sport, but I have put in a lot of hard work. So in the beginning, honestly, it was about the race trips and doing it together and running with friends and chatting and having a good time, which is a great reason to run.

Ally: Absolutely. Wow. And your first marathon was over five hours

Noa: Mm-hmm.

Ally: PR is well under four hours. What is it? Three 30? 3 26, sorry, not 30 26. is such a journey to go from over five hours to sub three 30, like crushing three 30 and now looking [00:13:00] for more. how in the heck did you make that progression?

Noa: I know it's wild that I think about it 'cause I've taken off over two hours and it was not quick. You know, initially the gains were big, like 30 minutes here, you know, 20 minutes, 15 now it's like begging for a minute or two. Uh, I think my last care, I was a few minutes, but now it's been in that. One minute or a plateau.

But overall, I think it's just putting in the work. It's like how do you get fast? You run more miles, you get very specific, you cross train. In the beginning, all I did was run, run, run and get injured, injured, injured. And then actually doing a stint in doing a few triathlons where I had to do other disciplines, the swimming, the biking, and then I got into strength and recovery and all the things that in our twenties we don't think we need to do.

That started making a difference and making me a more balanced athlete. So I think that was a big part of it. And just knowing what I was doing. And of course, good coaches, good teammates, all of that. And then the other thing for me that really made a [00:14:00] difference was just starting to think about the race as more than just physical and having a mental game to it of like, how do I get centered?

How do I push past discomfort? How do I keep going? If that's the goal, if time is your goal.

Ally: yes. Yeah, absolutely. And when you first got into it, you said your, one of your good friends had had you take her place. Right. was she part of a run club that then you joined after that? Like were you swept up into the running scene right away, or did that take some time to find.

Noa: Yeah, initially we did some group training with New York Roadrunners, which now I coach for. It's a full circle. We were level one of 20 back in the day. They would number it and one of 20 didn't sound great. So we have nicer names now like fundees for fundamentals. But again, everyone has to start somewhere.

And then after that she had signed up for team in training with Leukemia Lymphoma Society to do a race. And then I joined in with them. And that was the group I really trained with for a few marathons and my triathlons. And it was a great [00:15:00] community of running together, training together here in the city, but also traveling together to these races like Nashville and Vancouver, doing the New York City triathlon a few times with them.

So it really was sweeping me up into the friendships and adventures. And I did a few relay races with those folks. A lot of my friends today are still from that first team. It's just great energy. Like I. Was not part of group sports growing up. Like I mentioned, no group sports, nothing in high school or college.

So I think it's the energy that you get from something like running, even though it's an individual sport, it's so much more.

Ally: Absolutely. So with those first groups, were they, did they have like a group coach? Was there a coach that kind of helped with the whole group? Did you get an individual coach earlier on?

Noa: We had a group coach and then it was the PACE leaders, and then you had all of these volunteer positions, like mentors and learning more about it. So I became a mentor of sorts where you've done a few races, you can help out, you can watch. And I just became friends with one of the coaches and PACE leaders and I said, I'm into metrics, I'm [00:16:00] into data.

Can you start teaching me a few things? 'cause after I ran, I may or may not have run Vancouver with a broken leg. Whoops. I didn't know at the time.

Ally: Noa.

Noa: Just needed to step back and learn.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: he really helped me understand the value of. Everything I mentioned. And from there, just getting unofficial guidance from him helping out at some races for the team, kind of getting into the element of do I wanna get into coaching?

And then I switched to a different, more competitive team, got a coach, and then I realized everyone if they want, can benefit from having a coach, from someone really watching what they're doing, really giving them structure, really helping them listen to their own body and what signals to listen to. And also adapting and curating a good plan, a balanced plan for them.

So even though I coach a lot, I have my own coach as well.

Ally: Right. Yeah. I think you'd be pretty leery of a coach who doesn't have their own coach

Noa: Exactly. And people ask me that all the time and I'm like, no, I need an additional perspective too.

Ally: Yeah. It's the same concept. [00:17:00] Absolutely. Yeah. It took me a long time to find a coach. I'd been running for a long time. Uh, I started in 2007 with a half marathon, and I. ran every mile as fast as I could kind of a thing. It's like, oh, five miles today I'll go out and just run five miles as fast as I can. And so it was five years ago that I found a coach. And I cannot recommend it enough for people to, to have that level of accountability and insight and friendship. My coach and I are now really good friends. It's great. So it's been

Noa: Thanks.

Ally: and I think no matter your speed, no matter your experience level I agree with you very much so.

And

Noa: I love that. I'm so glad you found the right person. Like I have a lot of consult calls. I purposely keep my roster small so I can get to know my athletes and I really customize it to them. That's what I always say. It's like I wanna design it around your life and help you succeed and be your biggest cheerleader, but also give you a plan to progress and get to your goals.

And we wanna make sure it's the right fit. So the latest conversation I had last week, someone found me and I always like to say, where'd you find me? Just to see? She's like, honestly, like [00:18:00] I heard about you through X, Y, Z. I took a look at your site and what came out was for her, she's a back of the pack, about to go into her first marathon.

She's run a few halves, but it was the testimonials from first time runners and a bit slower. She's like, you coach fast, but you also coach back in the pack and give them as much love. Like I will be out there on the New York City marathon until my last athlete comes through and I'm gonna cheer just as hard for them as I will for the person in front.

When I was coaching and cheering for leukemia lymphoma, we had these honor teammates going through, you know, leukemia, and other blood cancers and we could be at the finish line really cheering them on. A lot of them are the last finishers of the New York City marathon, which stays open for many, many hours as, an important part of that major.

Ally: Which now thanks to social media, you get to see from afar,

Noa: Right. It's so powerful. Yeah,

Ally: good. Because they're just as, they've ran the exact same distance as everybody

Noa: exactly. You start and you finish and that's the biggest important part. We can have all of our goals, but the biggest thing is showing up to the start line, strong, [00:19:00] healthy, confident, and getting to that finish, like that's what I want my athletes to have and an amazing experience in the white or type two fund.

It might hurt and that's okay, but I'm enjoying it overall.

Ally: Do you have, what's the makeup of your athletes in terms of local to New York City area and virtual athletes?

Noa: Yeah, so I coach a speed group here for New York. Roaders, obviously all local. A lot of my one-on-ones are local, and then I have a bunch across the US and sometimes I'll get some Europeans as well. So

Ally: cool.

Noa: you to Apple Watch and Garmin and all the software that I use. It honestly can connect us virtually,

Ally: Yes.

Noa: things great.

yeah,

Ally: It has to be so fun to have that local team too. 'cause my coach is the same, a mixture, but we get our local team together at most local races, and so that is such a blast to be able to really feel like you're on a team, even though, like you said, it's a very much individual sport.

Noa: exactly.

Ally: Yeah. So you mentioned Vancouver. You mentioned Nashville was your first, what was your second marathon? What was in between those?

Noa: now I'm thinking, I'm like, wait, New York, Vancouver, I mean Nashville, Vancouver, New York. So [00:20:00] apologies. Vancouver was number two.

Ally: I was just trying to remember. okay, so Vancouver second, gosh, two hilly marathons. I'm surprised. And then New

Noa: Because I didn't know Allie, I didn't know that we want fast and flat. Like I, I am not an athlete. I didn't even think about it. It's not like everyone Google's now, like Fast marathon, US fall. No, I, I didn't know what I was looking for.

Ally: Yeah. You're like, oh, that sounds like a cool place

Noa: It sounded like a cool vacation, like number one. That's why I did it. I was like, oh, let's go to Vancouver.

We can head up Seattle, we can go to Napa. Like, that was really my priority. Not,

Ally: The,

Noa: the fast vibes.

Ally: Yeah. I

Noa: No. Didn't look at that.

Ally: I still don't necessarily, unless I'm going for time, look at the elevation profile. It's nice to know if there's like some big hills, like I just did the DC rock and roll and there's a monster hill in the middle, which

Noa: Hmm.

Ally: somebody said something about.

Otherwise I would've been very surprised. Yeah.

Noa: Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, for the ones I do for time, because any of my friends listening to this will laugh that I go very detailed. I will watch the ride along videos. I will note every single [00:21:00] hill. I will know the elevation. I have made my friends drive me through the entire course so I can mentally visualize it on the day.

So there are ones I do for time and there are ones I do for other goals, but now I'm that person that looks up elevation profiles.

Ally: And drives the court. That's so great. So when was your first international, right? Well, I guess, okay, let's not count Canada. Canada counts as

Noa: I know, I know. I mean, I've done, I've done Berlin, I've done Tokyo, Manchester last year,

Ally: Cool.

Noa: mentioned Berlin. Done a few

Ally: Awesome.

Noa: last year. Yep. Norway.

Ally: Norway,

Noa: my list. It's been 21, but it's sometimes hard to track. I've, I've listened to your podcast. I know you have the tracker. I need to make my tracker.

Ally: Well now when I talk to other people, I have

Noa: Give all your halves.

Ally: I wish I would've done my spreadsheet differently from the beginning. But it's fine. I could always change it up and just keep going now. But I don't have a lot of detail.

It's literally just the year,

Noa: Yeah. I listened to your podcast from last week and I'm like, this lady has her folders and the notes.

Ally: who

Noa: Yes,

Ally: of. I'm like,

Noa: yes.

Ally: if I could have just been like Sally from the [00:22:00] beginning. So yeah. What been your experience like traveling international for races? I haven't done one yet ' cause I would love to, but man. How do you like talk your athletes through thinking about the timing, like the time change, getting settled and all of those different things.

Noa: I think it's about getting comfortable with a few things that you might not be comfortable with and just leaning in. Just like you can't prepare for the race temperature and the star time is what it is, you're not gonna be able to. Plan for every tiny thing in an international and look, it is easier in a domestic.

That's why I try to balance, I'll have Rotter Dam now and then I'll go to Indianapolis in the fall. I think it's about getting there early and feeling very settled with the jet lag timing. So for this one, I'll travel on Wednesday, get there on Thursday. So I have three full days before the race and just getting on the same time zone.

If it's Europe, I'll go that early, but when I went to Tokyo, I went a full week early 'cause it's such a crazy [00:23:00] time difference that I wanna feel very settled.

Ally: Yes.

Noa: Then it's, gonna be the language barrier. Now every place speaks English. I do think a lot of athletes are like, how do you get along in, in more remote places?

And we'll get into it. But that's part of my company of making people feel safe and comfortable and doing things they might not do. And maybe wondering if. English is spoken in more remote parts of, let's say Norway. It is, but I totally understand that. People aren't sure about that. The other one is the food.

And I totally get, it's more difficult before a race. I'm a person with a ton of food preferences and food allergies. So right before I went to Tokyo and two of my friends came to cheer me on, shout out to Carolyn and Orley. I with all my allergies, I got a sesame allergy about a year before. I didn't even realize that there's so much sesame and Japanese food 'cause I just didn't grow up with it.

I got it in my thirties. So eating around supermarkets, eating in restaurants that I could eat, figuring out what I could eat, sending them off to eat, like [00:24:00] it does take sacrifice. But did I pack food that I could make and eat and also have a hotel with a kitchen? Yes. So a big thing for me, whenever I travel for a race, if possible, getting a kitchen or a place where you have access to a kitchen, like an Airbnb and or whatever apartment has been clutched, just like it would be for a US one.

But I think that comes into play even more in international, because you might want your regular white bread, but. In Japan, I'm dealing with the rice bowl, white rice, like little things like that that you could maybe practice when you're home before you travel, or even the kinds of drinks on the course.

I always take a look like, am I only gonna take water or is there something, I'm blanking on what they have in Tokyo, but like I had,

Ally: thing. What is it

Noa: yeah, I had ordered a case and I learned I did not like that beverage. Some people love it, my friend loved it. But yeah, so just, just to see what's, what's happening there.

Ally: that makes sense. Especially for Asia in particular.

Noa: Yeah, that was honestly like the biggest difference of food and everything else. Also Google Translate is my bestie [00:25:00] in terms of using the translator. I'll just walk around the markets being like, what is this?

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: I, I don't know. When you travel, I love going to like international supermarkets and just going to the candy aisle, going to the fruit aisle, going to the, you know, veggie aisle.

There's always like new interesting things to play around with.

Ally: Try. What year did you run? Tokyo.

Noa: Uh, 23.

Ally: Okay. All right. And then Berlin. Sorry, I'm quizzing

Noa: 2019.

Ally: Okay.

Noa: I have, now I have my cheat sheet, Ali. So now I could tell you these things 'cause before I did my 20th marathon, I did a lookback. 'cause it was important to remember

Ally: Yeah. What was your 20th, did you do something special for 20?

Noa: I did Manchester, in England, which was on lists for fast and flat and great. And I have to say for, you know, all those considering Manchester, it was incredible energy. It's such a cool British city. It's like a big city. It had a lot for a weekend. It was the hottest year of their entire racing history.

Like red Alert. It's actually the worst race sunburn I've had of my life. It does compete with Nashville 95 [00:26:00] degrees. But I think Manchester was worse, which when you think England, we think clouds and gray. Yeah, it was rough. But that happened to be number 20. I know. I was thinking, I was like, what's 25?

Sometimes like I make it very epic and purposeful and sometimes it's what it lands. But I did want to make it a whole trip and it was, it was a great trip overall and I made the best of that marathon. But I'm a positive person and I can say it was a heartbreaker. That was, that was a rough one.

Ally: Do you always travel with friends to these races?

Noa: Sometimes whenever I can, I love to do it. 'cause then we have the camaraderie, whether they're racing or just coming along for the ride. And then sometimes if people aren't available or aren't as interested in that place, I'm going solo. I feel comfortable going in, making new friends, exploring by myself.

Sometimes I link up with friends after, so I'm going solo to Rotterdam because that one became a lottery and nobody got in but me, which is okay. And I couldn't do a hard sell of going in the middle of April. But I have a friend who is working out in [00:27:00] Germany, so she's gonna come out and cheer, yay Victoria.

And then I will go to do Seldorf and see her after the race for a weekend as well. So I'm so excited. Yeah,

Ally: Yes,

Noa: but I always say like, if there's a race you wanna do, just go and do it. And again, this is why I'm doing small group and bringing people. But I did Scotland all by myself, and then I met up with friends who live in Edinburgh at the end.

But even with that, I don't know about, I posted something recently, I'm like, what is it about runners that I'm not scared to talk to new runners, but otherwise, it's like stranger danger. You might be an ax murderer, but if you're a runner and an ax murderer, maybe you're fine. Maybe you're a nice ax murderer who's been converted, which should not be my clip, but I'm just like, you know what it, it's like when you're walking to race morning inevitably in the dark.

Like I tend to be a good navigator because I like details. I've practiced the walk. I know where it is, I know where I'm going, and I pick up strays along the way and make friends kind of thing. So yeah.

Ally: well, clearly this is why you have a business doing this too. I'm just thinking, wow, you would be the best person to travel with for races. 'cause [00:28:00] you've got everything down dialed in. Other people don't have to

Noa: I can't help it. I'm, I'm spontaneous is not a quality of mine. I can do things, but I, take joy in making itineraries and agendas and knowing details, like I leave some open windows. I'm not a crazy person. I'm adaptable, but I am. That type A planning things out.

Ally: I am

Noa: Yeah.

Ally: bit, but not quite to that extreme you mentioned a partner earlier. do they run.

Noa: Oh, yeah. Travel, travel partner. I probably mentioned my, my business partner. Yes. No, it's me, me, myself, and I. Yes, yes, yes.

Ally: you.

Noa: okay.

Ally: at what point then in this journey did you decide, okay, like I've done this a few times, I'm, I would love to be able to bring more people along for this journey.

And then at what point did it become like, okay, like this is a business, I'm going to create this, and then tell me

Noa: I,

Ally: partner.

Noa: yeah, absolutely. idea for a while of bringing runners together because, I coached. For Leukemia Lymphoma. I [00:29:00] coached, uh, this other team, got them city runners for many years. Now I'm coaching for NYRR and just seeing people come together, forming those relationships, getting faster, finding joy, all of that is great.

And then I see people loving to race. So I thought there is something there. And I know there's lots of companies with running weekends and that's great, like run camps for me, I like to race, I like to go and I like to have that experience so, so great for people to tack on a bib and have a fake race.

It's not for me. Good for you. We'll put that out. But I was thinking that there's just no groups that go to actual races together with something very organized. Because some people, one might be intimidated to do it and maybe we're going to countries and places that we wouldn't otherwise. Some people might think, well, it's easier to go

Ally: somewhere

Noa: close and do the same race over and over 'cause I just don't wanna plan.

I don't have the time and the effort and the energy to put into it. And three, it's like, okay, I don't even. Maybe I would do it, but like I need a, I need a push to even like think of [00:30:00] this place that I've never even thought of. so I've kind of been circling around doing things as I met new people in races and different countries and that's kind of where this came together.

So, uh, my partner Shannon, is in the travel business and she left corporate life and was doing these one-on-one travel itineraries for Americans. And she had never gone into this group dynamic before. So that's where I brought Shannon in. She was not a runner when I met her. Now I'm training her for her first 5K,

Ally: Oh my

Noa: which is great, and she's killing it.

And then our Arthur partner, Jess, is in the business world and really leading the front and helping us think strategically and how we scale when we get to it. We are not just there yet, so I wanted like the right talents and I started as like the one runner, but also the traveler. So how do we bring groups together, go race somewhere, make the race the anchor, but help people really explore and enjoy and not worry about all those details.

Just like with coaching, when I want people to come to me, I will make [00:31:00] it work for your lifestyle. For your experience, I want you to show up to the race and do your thing, but I'll take care of the mental worry so you just know what to do each day and day and we can talk through the things.

Ally: Yes.

Noa: It was a long-winded answer.

I apologize. That was not a great answer.

Ally: So, okay. And then, so it's called paces in places

Noa: Yes,

Ally: you're planning your very first race right

Noa: yes. Talk paces and places. 'cause with my coaching, I've always said I can coach any pace, all paces and all places. So again, a lot local in tri-state area, but also coaching around, around the country and abroad. So this came up with thinking, okay, we're gonna do our paces, meaning we are inclusive and welcoming of runners of any pace and we're gonna go to really cool international races.

It started with an idea of maybe in the states, but I wanna also help people where they need us. You can plan your domestic trip and let's go to cool, interesting new places. So we are off to Norway as our first trip coming up in crazy enough, like two and a half months. So we have a [00:32:00] great group of ladies coming with me to the Midnight Sun Marathon in the Norwegian Arctic Circle.

And it's a race that I did in June, 2024. It was incredible and it was that kind of race that like when you're running it and you're like, am I actually doing this in here? Which was such an incredible moment. It starts at 8:30 PM I am an early two bed person, ally. I like to be in bed at 9 30, 10 o'clock.

So I told myself I'm not allowed to look at the clock. Like I don't wanna know what time of day I'm running. I don't wanna know anything but just what mile I'm on. Let's go for it. And that one was not a PR marathon. It was, let's just run and enjoy and see the things. And I'm never gonna, maybe I will one day, but I'm rarely going to race in the Arctic Circle at 8:30 PM on summer solstice.

So the difference up there, all of Scandinavia has more light, but in the Arctic Circle especially, it's 24 hour light and the sun is the brightest at two in the morning when you catch it, right? So you're running along this fjord in this city called Rezo, [00:33:00] and it's just really, really cool. And the Norwegians are out.

I wasn't sure. I was like, who's gonna be out? But looking back, obviously this is a big day for them and they have the Norwegian flags and there are tears. Like, hi. Yeah, hi. Yeah, hi. Yeah. And it's so cute.

Ally: Oh

Noa: And it was, it was awesome. And I went out to shake out and yeah. Okay. So some people were like, is there ice?

What's going on? What's the terrain? Which I get arctic circle, so actually it's cooler up there. So that was one of the appeals. Again, I love a cold race

Ally: yeah,

Noa: going north to find something doable in June is hard. So this was my race started, I wanna say like fifties, and then it ended up in the forties.

Like chef's kiss. Who would've thought a late night race gets colder?

Ally: right.

Noa: Yes. The crazy thing though with global warming is I had all. All weather and a week over there. So most of the time I was forties and fifties. The day after the race was 75. And I had made some friends along the way. I actually did like a little pilot for Pace and places, just messaging on Facebook and on Reddit of like [00:34:00] anyone coming from the states, anyone wanna meet up for a shakeout or a coffee.

So I met a few friends along the way. I actually coach one of the women that I met now shout out to Carrie, and the next day we were hanging out and saying, oh my God, it could have been 75. Now that's rare, and I hope we get a perfect race day this June. But for the most part, they're forties and fifties.

So it's a very temperate summer with snow in the mountaintops. But otherwise it's summery. Now there are beaches. Is the weather beach weather? No, it is freezing. So we dipped our toes in the next day and I did not go more than toe height, not even ankle. It was cold.

Ally: I would say maybe like right after the race as like a

Noa: Exactly.

Ally: yeah.

Noa: actually, I did go to the sauna. There's a sauna right in town and you're in the sauna and then you jump into the North Sea. so I have some videos. I'm doing that. It looks like I'm very scared, but it's freezing. Yeah,

Ally: my gosh. Yeah. Is the Sauna life really popular in Scandinavia?

Noa: is. It's so good.

Ally: Is

Noa: It's amazing.

Ally: it originated?

Noa: Yeah. Yeah. Like Finland's, like really the most known for it. And then [00:35:00] Sweden and Norway as well. So in Rezo they have this little hut that you can reserve for an hour and just get a coat. It's so nice. So you're in the sauna and then you can go and jump out into the North Sea.

You can tell who the locals are. The locals are doing laps, like they're literally swimming. And me, I'm doing like my one jump and then a quick like unattractive doggy paddle to get the hell out of there.

Ally: that. Yes, absolutely. I would. And okay. You've mentioned, now I see why you probably have friends all over the world, but did that, how did you make friends all over the world? Is it through running? Is it through work? Is it through family? How did that happen?

Noa: It's through life, through exploring, through running. Like a big thing I do, even if I'm just traveling for a hiking trip or something else active, is I like to see one if there's a run group, always like, can I join someone for a short run? My friend and I had gone out to Nova. Kosha just to go hiking. And I was like, let me just see if in Halifax there's a running club.

So like we joined them over there. Even the states, like my friend and I go to Rochester, let's find a local group. So you just connect that way. I [00:36:00] also, how I really got into small group trips and seeing the power of going solo, but with a group. I've done a lot of active trips in Europe and further going through, like this summer I went hiking in Mont Blanc, which is across Italy, Switzerland, and France.

And I'm very close with a bunch of them and inevitably those people are runners. So then I came back, you know, through those countries. I meet up with them. I have a really good friend in London that I met traveling in Ecuador, and then we went to Greece together. So it's like the like-minded people that you meet to run, to hike, to swim, to kayak, to do all these things and then you connect along the way.

Ally: Yeah. So for paces and places, what do you, what do you envision? Like, do, will you do more than one trip next year? Will you keep it to like, okay, we're doing one very dialed in trip a year, and then how does that line up with, do you have a other quote unquote, like normal job outside of it? How does that balance?

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Marker

Ally: and then how does that line up with, do you have a other quote unquote, like normal job outside of it? How does that balance?

Noa: You mean it's not normal to have three jobs right now, because

Ally: Nothing is normal.

Noa: I know, yeah, I have a, I have a full-time corporate job in media, in human resources, so that's my main gig. And then I call job two. My coaching, which

Ally: That's a

Noa: all of the things

Ally: on its own. Absolutely.

Noa: and places, is job three, but we are aiming to do three trips a year,

Ally: Okay.

Noa: two to three trips [00:38:00] a year.

So we have Scotland that we just opened also for the fall. So in end of September we're going to the Scottish Highlands to do the Lochness marathon, which I did last October

Ally: I want,

Noa: and Okay. Great.

Ally: about that. So continue, but yeah.

Noa: So we're gonna do that and then I haven't fully figured out my December, January. It's always a balance. So what I'm seeing more and more, and I would love your take of what races should we do, is a lot of the races fall.

On the exact same time, which I get, so we got everything in October, November, December, really October, November. Then we have everything in like April, may, and it's just trying to find the right balance. For now, my philosophy has been finding places that I have tried and tested. I do not want to bring a group to a place that I don't know.

If it's a good race, if it's well organized,

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: it's well supported in terms of, you know, hydration and everything. And I wanna kind of check out some of the experiences. So Scotland, when I went last October, we launched the company, [00:39:00] end of October. And I knew like, let me see what I think about Scotland and if I have a good vibe, we are going to come back here.

And Norway, I didn't even know that we were doing this yet, but I had a feeling of like, I will be back here in Tromso. So it's those kinds of races that we're experimenting with. I think we'll try to find something back in Asia, although with my food. Preferences and limitations, TBD, but my partner Shannon, would love that.

And then we're looking at other places like Iceland has a really cool Icelandic festival as part of their marathon. The other big thing I should mention is, again, back to the inclusiveness and welcoming all runners. I look for races that have multiple distances. So Norway has a 5K, a 10 KA half, and a full Scotland has a 5K, a 10 K, and a full.

And I look for races that have at least two distance options just to be able, because you would think in my mind initially, maybe I only travel for a full marathon. But no people could travel for any distance and that's incredible. Yeah.

Ally: I love that. Amen to that. That's smart. I know. It seems like, oh gosh, that's a lot of work to go across the world for a [00:40:00] 5K, but not for people that that's a huge deal. It's a huge deal. Yeah.

Noa: Huge deal. And or like they're traveling with a partner, like I have two partners traveling together and one is. Very into all this. And one was like, okay, I just wanna do the half and, and do that kind of distance. Yeah.

Ally: yeah,

Noa: Great.

Ally: you, but I'll just do, yeah. Five or 10, I

Noa: Exactly. And another one of our participants, it's her first marathon and I'm so excited.

Go Natalie. So like, let's go epic. You know, like it's for any goal, right? So I can train you. Another element of this is I train everyone who does these races. I meet them at their level, beginner, intermediate, advance. And I am thinking of that actual course. So Rezo, the midnights on marathon has a few hills in it.

So we are training for rolling hills for Scotland. Very challenging race that will involve even more hills. I promise. I will find some flat courses too. But for now, these beautiful destinations are beautiful because they have dramatic landscapes. So that's what we're getting.

Ally: Makes

Noa: Yeah. Yeah.

Ally: Natalie prepared to be just ruined for all future marathons. Oh my gosh. What a

Noa: I [00:41:00] know. I know,

Ally: experience.

Noa: cool and then you're like celebrating and it's like, what time is it? Should I go to bed? Never. Yeah. Yeah.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: really cool and we're gonna do a lot. The whole thing is we do a lot of activities before that will not hinder the running. So we're gonna go kayaking and play with huskies and do all the things, and then it's like, what do we do after for recovery?

We're doing this amazing float where we just float on the water in these like big puffy suits. I haven't done it before. So basically think like a wetsuit that's puffy and very, very floaty and just relaxing. And that is our recovery day.

Ally: my kid did ISR classes, so that's where they, like, they don't throw them in the water, but at the end you

Noa: Oh, yes,

Ally: on and you have to float on your back wearing a snowsuit. So

Noa: that's it. Okay. That's how I should describe it. It's taking us no suit and just floating

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: it sounds amazing. Yeah,

Ally: sound amazing, especially if the water's cool, but you're warm in the

Noa: exactly.

Ally: sign me up.

I really,

Noa: I'll let you know how it goes in June. Yeah, we're doing some new things that I haven't done, so I'm just excited. But I like to [00:42:00] think like, let's not exhaust you before the race and let's recover after too. But explore in a thoughtful way outside of just the race center. Like I see a lot of people doing these races, whether domestic or international and flying in and flying out.

And what we're trying to do is create experiences for five to six days, make it okay with vacation time, but really get to see the culture and the place. And the nice thing with this new, new small company, I'm trying to connect to all the race directors. They just appreciate that. Like we wanna see your country, like can you connect me with the head of the tourism board?

Like what local recs do you wanna do? We're planning all of this, but we've connected with small businesses over there. Like instead of like the big guns for Scotland, we have an amazing company, Highland Tours, and it's a father and son duo and they're so kind and they're making it runner friendly. So for example, we started and I saw the itinerary, 30 minutes here, 30 minutes here, 30 minutes of distillery.

I'm like, okay, slow it down. We wanna relax, we wanna enjoy our drams of whiskey. I wanna enjoy petting my Scottish two for as long as I [00:43:00] want. I wanna be in the sauna like and we wanna walk. It was like 30 minutes at this spot. I'm like, no, no. We need to move our legs. Two hours hike at a gentle pace. So it's just nice to work with some of these smaller local businesses to really customize it to what we would need from a runner's perspective.

Ally: smart. Okay, let's go back to Lochness, because

Noa: Yes.

Ally: so cool. is it around the, is there a Lake Lochness?

Noa: Yes. Okay. So my friend Craig had run all these races in Scotland and he's a trail runner. I am not a trail runner. I would love to be one day, 'cause I love spending time in the mountains. I do a lot of hiking, but that is intimidating from someone in New York where we don't have a lot of trails for me, even though he lives here.

So he does a great job. I don't know. Do you trail run at all?

Ally: no, not for anybody who's listening, who's an actual trail

Noa: Yeah, exactly. And a lot of.

Ally: runners, right?

Noa: Exactly. Road, road runners. So I am a road runner. It is what I am good at. I am open to it one day, but what I wanted was a cool race in Scotland, seeing his incredible pictures. And he had mentioned this race to me because it goes [00:44:00] parallel to one of the trail races he had done.

So this race block, this marathon, which I hadn't heard about and when I went it is like 80% local Scottish people. Then 10%, 15%, like another UK and 8% international. So small. So Inverness is the capital of the highlands, and Lochness actually means the male ness. So if you think of Nessie as a monster, he is a man.

Of course, I'm kidding.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: that is where there's a lot of mythology

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: fairy myths and things around the highlands. Scottish Gaelic is spoken in the Scottish Highlands, not in Edinburgh or more North. And it's just a very magical place. So this city where the race is based is called Inverness, the biggest city in the Highlands.

And this race, you load up the buses, I wanna say it's like 10,000 people all in between the three races. So not too big. And you drive backwards onto the race. And I'm always like, why was an hour and a half like I wanted to experience it. It's 'cause it's really windy. And you're going to the top of this mountain, big hill.

And then it's in the fall [00:45:00] and end of September, October. And all the hills and the trees are the fall, beautiful colors. And it's basically a thin little road that you are all lining up for the marathon. And it starts with this amazing band and they have the Scottish bagpipes and they're walking down the whole race and they have a song for the Highland. So it's like super powerful. And when the gun goes off, you are running downhill into this like gorgeous, like down the mountain, basically like field, and a few miles in you're running alongside the lock.

So it's like Riverside running, running, running. It is high land, so very hilly, but you basically are running from deep in the Highlands back to Inverness, and it's. Pretty challenging, but very, very cool and rewarding. But what goes up must go down. So there are good downhills as well. And then I would say it's definitely a race that you run within yourself, as someone described it when I asked them at the expo, because it's a little quieter and there's not a lot of spots for cheer sections because of just where it is [00:46:00] more remote.

But then as you get closer and closer to town and at these water stations, the locals come out, there's more bagpipes, there's more cheering. There's a lot of nessie and blow up. Nesses and Nessie plushies. I was very into it. A lot of plaid going on everywhere. And then, yeah, get to the finish. But I thought it was just a really cool spot.

And this town is small, but it's very charming and unique and I spent a few days there before and after and it was incredible. And like a gateway to the Highlands to then go to this place called the Island of Sky, if you've heard about it. And that's this big island that is just gorgeous and has all this nature and waterfalls and incredible like fairy myths.

Castles galore,

Ally: So Locke is a river.

Noa: There is a lock. There is the lock river and then there's different water things. But the actual lock is a lake.

Ally: Okay. And that's, and obviously the mythology around the lochness monster, which looks right like a brontosaurus, almost like a dinosaur.

Noa: Mm-hmm.

Ally: picturing the right thing. I'm like just making sure 'cause that's what I'm picturing [00:47:00] When you said Nessie and like all the plushies and does, does the race medal or the shirt honor that mythology?

Does it have like the lochness monster on it? Are they,

Noa: Oh my God, yes. They have this old icon that is a man running that we need to replace and be more inclusive, but some of their new swag has a shoelace in the shape of Nessie. And I was like, yes, go with this. So it's so cute. So you see like a sneaker and then it's like the shape of Nessie, which is really cute.

Yeah.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: Yeah.

Ally: have, do you have a list of races that you're like, okay, these are like bucket list races that you personally want to go do?

Noa: I have a few in my head. I will eventually, like I've done, I've done most of the majors, not all, but it's more of these like incredible, like at some point I do wanna do like. The wall of China, like all that kind of like cool different Asia places. I would like to go back to Japan. There's a bunch in Europe that I would still wanna do.

the good thing is I don't do any of these, like I must do the majors or I must do the 50 states that are incredible. I just kind of see what am I inspired to do that year [00:48:00] and what sounds fun and exciting to me and what part of the world do I want to travel to. So there's a few like super hard ones.

Like I've been to Switzerland a few times at Yung for a marathon, which is a betrayal. It just looks beautiful. Like I would like to do that. Don't care if I have to walk a little bit,

Ally: Wow.

Noa: love to do that. There's races in Argentina I would love to do. There's just a bunch of countries that I would love to go back and run,

Ally: yeah,

Noa: thinking about next year and I'm like, I don't know just yet, which is crazy 'cause there are of course a bunch of good American races I would like to do.

I still wanna do CIM. There's a few big ones that I'd love to

Ally: yeah,

Noa: into.

Ally: yeah. Try to do the ones that aren't quite as competitive to your point, like I also like how your mindset about the majors, I mean, they're just so big and they're so hard to get into, anybody who's listening who's like newer to the sport and feels like they, like, that's what they have to go do. It's like not at

Noa: Exactly. And the whole thing now is, it's just insane how this running boom has gotten, which I know you talk about a lot and it's hard to get into these races, but [00:49:00] other races exist in the world, so that's not a reason to go do a different one. But it's a reason to say, okay, with all of these being full, what else is in the world that is a top scenic race?

A place I want to go and visit regardless. Something maybe a little smaller that I feel a little overwhelmed with these real big majors and I don't wanna feel like I'm getting shoved and stepped on, which I just had an experience in a big race that was great, but I don't like to be stepped and shoved on in a giant race with a lot of people.

So it's, you know, I get it. These race directors are balancing. Getting in a lot of people, but also keeping an organized race. And with the smaller, more international races, it's just an added, place to enjoy. Because now 35,000 doesn't sound so small when you have 60,000 people marathons, and it's just,

Ally: Yes.

Noa: yeah.

But when I do see 10,000, I'm like, that's small.

Ally: spot. Yeah,

Noa: Yeah.

Ally: like smaller races like indie, like we started the

Noa: Mm-hmm.

Ally: talking about, it's like we're like 17,000

Noa: Mm-hmm.[00:50:00]

Ally: across the distances and that to me feels like a very big, it is a very big deal. Like

Noa: Yep.

Ally: you know, taking over the city, but, you know, in the grand scheme of things, you're like, wow, that's like less than a third the size of New York.

Noa: Exactly, exactly.

Ally: yeah.

Noa: think, well, I did one city marathon. I was reminding myself of the number. So one city is in Virginia, so I had heard really good things. It's in March, they organize it so well. This town takes such pride in their marathon. It's Newport News, Virginia. The marathon signs are permanent traffic signs year round, like metal, permanent signs.

Yes.

Ally: Oh,

Noa: It's so cute and it really, like they love that race and it has everything a half marathon, a 5K, a kids race. so I thought that was a really great small race and it, I think it's also finding how many people do you need versus what might be too small. So honestly, that one is a thousand people.

So I was in a PACE group. It was a really hot day. I had to let them go and run my own race. I ran by myself for 12 miles. Thank God a cop pointed me in the right way. 'cause I [00:51:00] could have just been one of those people that turned wrong. And I learned why I love that marathon might be a little too small for me.

So I see these races that are like 500 people and that's a little small for me. So I think like it's how many people do you need in a race ish? Do you need a lot of people near you? Do you not want a lot of people? What's the balance of having space to not leave, but not being too crowded? Or some people love a giant race with a lot of spectators lining up the whole thing and that's okay.

That's great. Honestly, when I started running, I needed that. I needed to run with a running buddy. I needed a lot of cheering.

Ally: A hundred percent. Well, and I feel like all these, these places you're mentioning that you've already talked about, there's not tons of spectators. 'cause these courses don't really allow for that. Uh, I was trying to think. I don't know that I've really done, my full marathon. The, the least amount of spectators I've had as Indy, which, you know, we do a decent job. We're constantly trying to improve. 'cause you know, the

Noa: I think it was pretty good, actually. I thought it was a good crowd. Yeah.

Ally: pretty good. We've gotten, I mean, over the years, getting better and better as more and more people like, understand what's going on on race day and, and trying to invite people proactively to like

Noa: Mm-hmm.

Ally: in their [00:52:00] yard and things like that.

So

Noa: Yeah. And I will say New York City Marathon Day is my favorite day in the city. It's a million spectators, I'm sure more now. And I haven't run that one in ages. I ran it once. I love to be out there to see my people, to cheer like, because it's like that energy and I coach a lot of people and I wanna see them honestly and cheer them on.

So that brings me the most joy. I do wanna do it one year again as a party race and just take it all in. I was supposed to do it a second time for Hurricane Sandy year, so I do have that medal, but that was the one year it was canceled. So

Ally: wild.

Noa: one for the

Ally: was that

Noa: books,

Ally: Like how far in advance of that race did they cancel it? I can't

Noa: uh, I forget if it was a day or two days before I was at the expo and they announced it, I wanna say two days.

Ally: did they come over like the loudspeaker in the

Noa: Yes. I remember having the jacket and I was like, lemme put the jacket back.

Ally: So sad. Well, I

Noa: It was sad.

Ally: on who she needs to come to your trips. She would be amazing. Quincy, and she was on the indie board at the time of San [00:53:00] Hurricane Sandy. And she talked about how we in indie had such an influx of runners because of that cancellation.

Noa: Yep.

Ally: of a sudden Googled were like, where can I go to use this training block?

And so they came, a lot of them came to Indianapolis.

Noa: I was part of team and training at the time and we like found some people go to Philly, some people go here, some people go there. And I went to one of these smaller marathons just to help and cheer. And honestly, that got me more into coaching. Just seeing these people so down of like, let's remember it was a beautiful training block.

We can't control that. It was canceled, but how can I be there for you to jump in to help you, to cheer for you and make this race that you didn't expect something incredible. And that really started it for me.

Ally: So tell me on New York City Marathon Day,

Noa: Mm-hmm.

Ally: like set up shop, do you have goodies, like, do you have snacks and fuel? Do you have signs? Do you have music? Do you have a bullhorn? Like what does your strategy for spectating?

Noa: Okay. I'm a little bit of a crazy person, so I run around and see people at different places, but it's really incredible how much I can fit in my [00:54:00] pockets. Like I'm surprised that my pants haven't fallen off yet. ' cause we got the salt stick. Salt chew going in there. We got extra gummies, we got tissues, we got full salt.

We have some snacks for me. I have many layers. Am I gonna get cold? Am I gonna get warm? I'm gonna be out there for six hours. So my team got them. City runners. Ever has been out in Harlem Near Mile, I think it's 21, 22, and we just set up shop. So what's nice about race day is even though this team sunset a few years ago, you know that GCR will be standing at the spot.

So who am I gonna see this year? So first of all, it's incredible energy. One of my friends, Meg has the loudest voice you'll ever meet in the best of ways. She doesn't even need a bullhorn, but she helps us all scream. They're bringing the signs. You just tell them what name, whether they know or not. So we are parked there and it's an important spot 'cause it's before you turn onto Fifth Avenue, which is the big hill before Central Park.

So people need that energy. And I run in between first Avenue and Fifth Avenue and then I'm in the park and then I'm at the [00:55:00] end. But if anyone like needs anything or if they want me to. Carry something. It said, one of my friends ran with like a happy birthday banner. I'm like, that looks like a struggle.

Do you want it? They ended up wanting to keep it, but I'm like, I'll take your happy birthday banner if you are over it, because sometimes after 20 miles you might be over it and I can't tell.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: I like to say when I check in with them, like I'll jump in really briefly and check in with them that, they don't have to talk to me.

They can talk to me, they can be happy, they can be mad. I just ask. They don't spit at me. And I think that, that it's a good rule, you know, just, just whatever you need. It's just, it's a rule that's worked for me for many years. Yes,

Ally: I, so the year that I ran was 2018, and I remember I texted, my friends were spectating because they had to defer to my friends. And then one of my friends, she and I both ran it and she was the reason I ended up running it. 'cause I'm like, well, she's gonna do it. I need to do it this year.

And so I remember texting them and being like, pretzel was all I could manage to text.

Noa: yes.

Ally: all that's all I wanted was pretzels. That's it.

Noa: Salty things. [00:56:00] Yep.

Ally: And they, when I got to them, I was like, do you have the pretzels? And they were like. didn't know what you meant. I was like, what do you mean

Noa: What, Ali, I would've brought you pretzel. Okay. If you ever come back to New York, I'll have pretzels for you.

Ally: Well, the Um.

I went and spectated, so I brought a bag of pretzels and I made a sign that said pretzels on it. And then my New York spectating story is that Tyler Cameron. and, and Matt, James both came and they got, Matt got pretzels out of my bag

Noa: That's incredible. It's incredible.

Ally: yeah.

Noa: a, it's a good item, right? Like when I am running, I might be half delusional, but I'm looking at signs. I'm looking at your things. I might not take you up on it, but it's fun to look at.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: When I did Nashville and it was super hot, some lady had orange slices out of a baggie.

I would never consider this Ali. I don't even like citrus fruits, but it tasted freaking delicious and I can't explain that. It was the world's most refreshing, most delicious orange slice of my [00:57:00] life.

Ally: I can taste it. I mean, I had popsicles at Chicago

Noa: so good.

Ally: I've never loved a Popsicle more in my life. Donut holes I've had. also really good. But yeah, I usually wouldn't Yeah, except food from strangers except during a marathon when I'm desperate and I'm like,

Noa: Exactly. Like we came back before, it's like, yeah, I'll take, I'll take anything.

Ally: back to Rotterdam. So your current PR is 3 26. Do you have a goal you've put out there in terms of time?

Noa: Ooh, okay. I haven't, I haven't put it out there before, but I would like to break 3 25. I've been training for a 3 23. It might be aggressive, but I'm hoping for even a second. PR under 3 26 would be

Ally: yes. I'm so excited for you.

Noa: It would be incredible. I have had the unfortunate luck of bad weather the last few races,

Ally: So

Noa: and I just had to adjust in the minute.

Ally: Yeah. at least you have your mindset right for that. But I really hope that you get good weather. I guess it's in within the 10 day forecast.

Noa: It should be

Ally: a lot,

Noa: it looks like, yeah, forties, fifties, maybe low [00:58:00] 60. I just don't know what the peak of the day, because you think 10:00 AM that's fine, but then. Goes into the afternoon and it could be a little challenging, but I'm trying not to freak out about it just yet. It's like I tell my runners not to look.

It can change, but of course I have a favorite on Rotterdam and check it every day. Who does it? Let's not pretend like we're not doing that,

Ally: Yeah. People who tell

Noa: I hope

Ally: the weather lies.

Noa: know. No, And it's okay to run some races for fun and run and say I want to be fast. And both are. Both are great.

Ally: Yeah, so you've b queued, clearly. And so have you done Boston, I'm assuming.

Noa: I have, yeah, I did in 2019 and 23. And like I said, I, I had to work hard over 10 years to get a bq

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: you know, when I, when I talk to people and they're like, how'd you do it so quick? I'm like, it wasn't, it was hard work and dedication and I wanted to do it. I did not consider it when I got a 5 32 in Nashville, but as I got closer and closer and had probably like a four 30, I'm like, [00:59:00] okay, maybe it's something that we can consider just to see.

And Boston doesn't make it easy, but it is such a mindset and a destination of like, can I make it a goal? Whether you do run Boston with a time qualifier or else, I feel like the few times, the two times I've done it, just showing up to race weekend. Have you ever been to cheer

Ally: Oh, I haven't been. I need to go,

Noa: something about, and I had gone like a different two years to cheer. You just get there and it just. Hits you. It's like this is like the runner's race and it's so magical and I'm not a super emo person, but like definitely cried a tier two of like, this is so cool and so special. And I actually think for me, getting those BQs was more important than the actual race.

While I love the Boston weekend, I've had two horrible races. Those are like top three terrible races for me that day. But getting those BQs are such highlights for me.

Ally: Yeah. I'm chasing it and it's, it's a lot of work.

Noa: It's a lot of work. My first one, IIB queued in Steamtown, which is an incredible other east coast race I should [01:00:00] mention. It's in Scranton, Pennsylvania. It's small, it has amazing energy, and while it's not lying the whole time, you always have people next to you and they do a great job with these cheer stations.

It just, people come out, it's so good. Highly recommend. Steamtown and I be queued with over three and a half minutes and got rejected by 20 seconds. It was one of those, I think it was like the biggest cutoff in many years. Now. We see these crazy like four or five minutes, but at the time, and I just remember it was such a low, but it's also, it's okay to be devastated by it.

But looking back, I gave that a lot of energy and now I'm like,

Ally: hard.

Noa: happen for a reason and it will happen when it happens. And then my next BQ was the one that, that did it.

Ally: Amazing. Yeah. Well, we'll see. I would love to come out and spectate before I even qualify or run. I mean, it's typically the same weekend as our Carmel marathon, so

Noa: Oh,

Ally: suburb of Indianapolis, and so I live in Carmel

Noa: which is a race that I've looked at. So actually last year when I debated Manchester Carmel was the backup, and I know it was [01:01:00] canceled last year. So it was just crazy when Nicole and I were out there in Manchester, like hearing that news.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: so I felt really, really bad for those marathoners, but I've heard amazing things about that race weekend.

Ally: wonderful. Yeah, it's pretty flat rolling hills. I, 'cause I've gotten in trouble for saying it's flat, so for flat landers it's not flat for people who run hilly, it's pretty flat.

Noa: Yeah.

Ally: yeah, it's a great race. Nice and small, but like, you know, big enough, maybe 6,000, I don't know. Yeah,

Noa: No, that's a good size. Yeah,

Ally: But it is bo like right up next to Boston, so usually it's, you know, locals are maybe not going 'cause they're going to Boston or,

Noa: know There's so many good races at the exact same time.

Ally: yeah. It's just, yeah. Like you said, trying to find some that are kind of off of the peak seasons. I, I am interested, I just ran rock and roll DC for St. Jude and so their big races in Memphis, Tennessee.

Have you ever done that? The St. Jude

Noa: No,

Ally: So it's in Memphis and it's like, runs by the hospital and people just say it's such an incredible experience and it's, I think mid-December. So that one's been on my radar [01:02:00] forever, but

Noa: that's a nice time of year. There's not as many good like December ones. That's why I've looked at CIM. Yeah.

Ally: So we, we shall see. I, I like looking on the internet for like random races that have, I have a list I should have looked at before this that has just random, weird, fun races that might like give out something weird at the end or it's just like a unique type of scenario and they could be international or local, but I'm trying to build a list of races that I want to go do for fun.

Noa: Okay, so it's kind of similar. I like races with a good tagline. I think more races need taglines.

Ally: Okay.

Noa: is America's friendliest mid-size marathon.

Ally: Cool.

Noa: which one? Twin Cities is America's most beautiful urban Marathon,

Ally: Okay.

Noa: They have all of the lakes, which would be beautiful. But when I did it, my friend and I had a beautiful sunrise that became the stormiest day we've ever run through.

Ally: Oh

Noa: will never forget her running through the finish line and just screaming. What the act did. We just do, we did it. I mean, again, another race. I keep getting these races that really should be not running because they're dangerous with thunder. But we live to [01:03:00] tell the tail

Ally: Yeah,

Noa: and through the rain. It was America's most beautiful urban race.

the Midnight Sun Marathon is the northern most road race in the world. So

Ally: Cool.

Noa: know Richmond is the world's friendliest marathon. I haven't done that yet, but Richmond's on my list.

a tagline.

Ally: We have one and I knew it and I

Noa: What is it?

Ally: check before I was a liar. it is a beautiful place to set your pace, which is cute, but also I feel like could use some more speed in the

Noa: We, we need a little, we need to be a little jazzed up. It feels a little broad to me. I like it. It's a good starting place. You are a.

Ally: who aren't from here are like beautiful place. Like, yes, it's beautiful here, but people from outside of here are like, it's Indiana. Like what do you mean it's

Noa: Yeah,

if anyone can workshop it, it's cute.

Ally: the city of speed is what our city is, is

Noa: Oh,

Ally: kind of as a whole. And so the marathon is definitely gonna jump on that bandwagon.

'cause I'm like yeah, city of speed.

Noa: perfect. That

Ally: Perfect.

Noa: would totally appeal to people. That's perfect. Yes,

Ally: So, yeah. okay, so

if people are like, oh my gosh, [01:04:00] pace is, and places sign me up for that.

Like, what does that look like?

Noa: so we have two open trips right now. We have our trip to Norway that closes in a few weeks. Don't know when this will air, but we close down soon.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: That's okay. And we have Scotland Open, and I should mention these trips. We keep small by design, so it's 12 participants max.

Ally: Okay.

Noa: they can reach out to me on, we'll put all the info I'm sure somewhere,

Ally: Yes. In the

Noa: Paces places at Instagram.

And we do a lot of webinars because I know that it's hard to get a sense of what is a small group trip like, what is the experience gonna be like for me? Am I gonna have a little downtime? Yes. Am I gonna have amazing activities? Yes. Am I gonna get trained for the race? Yes. But we like to show our faces, talk about the day-to-day itinerary, answer any questions like, is there ice on the road in Norway?

No. But I wanna answer all questions so if anyone reaches out, happy to tell them more. But

Ally: smart.

Noa: two races and then if they follow us, we will publish our 2027 pics in a bit and see where we go from [01:05:00] there.

Ally: And then what is the typical price point? Or like is there a range What does that

Noa: Yeah, it's a great question. We try to keep them as reasonable as possible. And also the big thing that we've noticed is we're getting a lot of solo travelers that would wanna come and do an experience in a small group. So as someone that solo travels, I'm always thoughtful of how can we make something reasonable without a big solo tax quote unquote, to add on.

So it's a few thousand dollars. So Norway, we made as reasonable as possible Scotland same. So three to 4,000, 5,000 kind of thing. Is our range

Ally: Okay.

Noa: than other packages? We actually are competitive versus marathon tours with our Scotland tour that I just happen to notice and I should add, all our trips are all in, so you just show up and race.

We take care of all the accommodations, all the food, all of the activities, all the transportation beyond the international flights. Norway people got their own race bibs, Scotland. I now own race bibs because who knew that race just sold out last week. A small race which sold out last year in July is not now sold out.

[01:06:00] Which is crazy.

Ally: this

Noa: Yes.

Ally: man.

Noa: This running boom.

Ally: though. 'cause I'm like, I can't plan my entire year out. I,

Noa: Well, and that's, that's it. It is, people have to plan earlier and earlier, like, and I like really debated. I'm like, oh my God, do you have to buy race bibs? What am I gonna do? What if I end up with race bibs? I had to, I, I don't know, Allie, I, I now own race bibs. I'm like, uh, ideally they come in and join the race package.

Worst case I, transfer them just face value and everything. but I was like, this is not a game I wanted to play in. But yeah.

Ally: So I think of Marathon tours as an example. I think that's a name people know, but if people are wondering, okay. Well. What's different? Why paces and places in comparison? Could you talk a little bit about that?

Noa: yeah, absolutely. I think there's big operators like marathon tours that are known for our race, sold out, let me get a bib from them. And the bib comes with a small trip, but that small trip is hundreds of people maybe. A thousand people. A big, big group that you get on big tour group, the big hotel block, whatever it is.

And Paceon [01:07:00] Places is different because we are small, intentional. We are trying to create community driven trips with 12 people max. So we get to know each other. We actually have a few Zoom connects ahead of the trip. We have WhatsApp groups for everyone to boast about their latest races. Some of our participants for Norway just did the Prague half Marathon.

We're talking about that. We connected about the New York City half. So we have that whole thing. So we show up, getting to know each other, and then when we get there, it's a small group trip all in. But again, small by nature. So we travel together, we race together, we celebrate together, we recover. But I think it's that small group and that interactive nature.

You can still be introverted and come on our trips. We'll have some downtime. We'll find the right balance, but this is for that person that might not wanna go. So. Solo and plan everything on their own or feel intimidated to have a small community but not be overwhelmed with a big group trip or be lost in the fold and just go on this giant coach bus experience of sorts.

Ally: Wow.

Noa: No, no. Like hundred person pasta dinner. We're talking eight [01:08:00] person pasta dinner where you can actually talk as a group about, what's our favorite sauce before race day. Really critical things. Yeah.

Ally: well and that's such a good point because I think people are just craving that community and like I asked you, you know, how do you have all these friends all over the world? Well, it's 'cause you've done and experienced things like this. And so you, I would imagine, leave one of your trips with, I mean, 11 new, very close friends. So that's pretty cool.

Noa: It's the best. And it's like you might have, people have a ton of friends, but they might not want to go to these places and race and do this kind of thing for fun. It's my kind of fun, right? Like I think it's fun to go hiking in the Alps for seven days. That's a little much for my other friends, but I meet like-minded people and then I can connect with them and I can have my city adventures with some friends here.

Awesome. And then I can have my travel friends. The idea of facing places is go on one trip, meet some friends, maybe we're all close by in New York, then you can go on runs with them here and continue those relationships. Maybe you made new friends in other states [01:09:00] and you continue those relationships and you travel with them in the future, whether it's with me or with each other.

So I would love to grow a building community

Ally: That's

Noa: from there.

Ally: so people, some might be solo, some might be like with their best friend,

Noa: Mm-hmm.

Ally: there a limit, like if somebody has a core group of their runner girls, right? Like, could they, could like six people join

Noa: Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. we're open to, everyone we're noticing it's this like thirties to 50 kind of age range, or fifties I should say, and more solo travels. But we are open and welcoming of everyone. I can see in the future of doing like a women's trip, of doing a guy's trip, a dad's trip, whatever we want.

Like I could see the opportunity for now we're open, but it's interesting of who we're attracting. I do think some of these small group experiences, not just running related, tend to attract more women just for like the safety element and the community.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: we also have a lot of guys come in for the adventure of it.

Scotland is challenging, like let's get that badge and do it.

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: I am definitely welcoming of everyone and I'm so curious of how those dynamics [01:10:00] will work together on the group.

Ally: Well, and you never know, you could like be a matchmaker all of a sudden too,

Noa: Exactly.

Ally: if you get like a combo group. Like what a cool way to meet somebody. , Okay. I'm gonna ask you the end of the podcast questions. the first one is, what is your favorite running song and or mantra

Noa: It's a longer winded answer, but for those who know me, I memorize 26 mantras for every single marathon, one per mile,

Ally: memorized?

Noa: me zone into that mile. So they start very, very positive. My 18 is always shut up buttercup. But my go-to, I have one that's always the overall, and then one relentless is one of my words that I wear in a bracelet.

Ever since I started running with a charity team for Leukemia, lymphoma, and Relentless For a Cure was where it started. But for me, relentless forward motion and. determined, keeping going. Anything, one step in front of the other, whatever happens with the race is always a key mantra. And then the race itself gets an overall.

So for the last marathon I just did the catchphrase of [01:11:00] the city was make it happen. I'm like, great, let's make

Ally: Oh yeah.

Noa: but we're gonna make it happen.

Ally: And spoiler alert, you did?

Noa: it

Ally: Yeah. do you listen to music while you run?

Noa: do, I do. I do a lot of pop and or nineties mixed

Ally: Nice.

Noa: it was a lot of dance and euro pop when I do my international races.

And then we go more nineties, boy band, girl band when I do the US ones. So.

Ally: Oh, I love that. That's so amazing. You memorized 26 of them. Good idea.

Noa: part of the ritual of going into the marathon and getting my mental strength and readiness. So if anything goes off the rails, it's a way to just bring myself back, get back into whatever sense of control I can and not mile and focus.

Ally: Perfect. And then your next finish line and milestone, if I would've asked you when we were initially recording, you would've said Rotterdam marathon, but now we're recording after. And so give us an update on that race.

Noa: I just got back, so I ran Rotterdam Marathon in the Netherlands and for those who don't know that city, it's a bit outside of Amsterdam and it was [01:12:00] incredible. I got my pr,

Ally: You did. Oh my gosh, yeah. Listening back to our episode, you were like, it would be incredible if I could sneak under 3 26 and you, you did. So I was so happy.

Noa: Yeah. So thrilled to give you that update. It was just everyone in that city comes out. It was incredible. Of my 22 marathons, I would say this was a top three in terms of. Spectators. And as I learned on that day, there are a lot of Dutch female Noas, which I am not used to living here in New

Ally: Okay.

Noa: a few, but not so many, but that meant everyone was cheering my name. There were a chance. It was such great energy and I forget how much that can help you, especially in the later miles and just making it a very positive day. So

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: I had a friend and her dog cheering loudly. The

Ally: Oh,

Noa: of course, very much cheering loudly and it was, it was an amazing finish line.

Ally: I'm so happy for you, Noa. That's so exciting.

Noa: Thank you.

Ally: Okay, and so now what would be your next finish line from here?

Noa: Now I'm gonna see you and Indie next fall is gonna be the [01:13:00] next big

Ally: Okay,

Noa: until then, some short races, including the Brooklyn Half and the mini Women's 10 K

Ally: Oh, so jealous. It's very, very cool races. And you know what else is funny, Noa? When we recorded, we talked about caramel and the weather and all that, and then we got postponed. So it was very sad.

Noa: and I saw that when I was in Europe. I was like, oh, and I read your whole thing about thoughts about it,

Ally: Thank you. Yeah.

Noa: but it's so heartbreaking and I

Ally: Yeah.

Noa: such a tough decision

Ally: So sad, but yeah, I was listening back and I'm like, oh man, if, if only I knew where this was going, but yeah. Right. Call, hard call. Again, congratulations on your new shiny pr. How did you, how did you celebrate actually?

Noa: Well, I celebrated with going all over the Netherlands, Germany, and Belgium, and

Ally: Oh my.

Noa: Europe and hanging, so that was really the big celebration.

Ally: perfect. Oh, I love it. Well, what a way to celebrate.

Well, this has just been so much fun, Noa. Thank you for doing this.

Noa: Thank you. You're [01:14:00] incredible. I hope, I hope there was some usable things in there. I so appreciate you.

Ally: I just wish that we would've chatted more in person, but I'm so happy we now have the chance 'cause you're

Noa: Exactly. Yes. I can't wait to hang.

Ally: Yeah,

Noa: Yes.

Ally: Well,

Noa: And you've been such a support just online and reposting, like I really, really mean it when I say I appreciate all of, like, the support from early days. So, and I know you have your, obviously this podcast and your other business, and just, you get it.

It's, it's hard in the beginning, so I appreciate it.

Ally: a hundred percent. Well thank you and thank you to everybody who has listened and happy running. We did it

If you enjoyed this episode of Finish Lines and Milestones from Sandy Boy Productions, please head to the show notes to sign up for email newsletters. I send a weekly Finish lines and milestones newsletter with some of my updates from my personal running journey, the most recent episode.

Products. I love upcoming events. I try to make them not suck, so please support me by doing that. If you already subscribe, of course you can share rate, review the podcast. That always helps other people find it. Thank you again to this week's [01:15:00] new sponsor batch. Head to hello batch.com. Use code finish for 30% off and

also, go to paces and places.com to check out the upcoming trips that Noa It's gonna be super fun to watch where they continue to go.

Gosh, I hope I'll be able to go on one of those trips one day and be sure. If you're an Indie and running the Indie Mini or you're local, be sure to get tickets to the live podcast with Lindsay Hein and Emma Grace Hurley on May 1st. Again, that link is in the show notes. Okay.

Ally: Alright, and thanks for listening. I will talk to you next week. Bye.

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