Finish Lines & Milestones Podcast: Episode 155: Keegan Kok - Get Comfy with the Uncomfy

Finish Lines & Milestones Podcast: Episode 155: Keegan Kok - Get Comfy with the Uncomfy

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Guest: Keegan Kok @keegan_breaksaway⁠

Show Notes:

Keegan Kok⁠ and I met through the internet first, and then got to meet in person at the CNO Indianapolis Monumental Marathon last November.

During this episode, sponsored by ⁠Amazfit⁠, we talk about:

  • How he grew up in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia, moved to Hong Kong at 16, and ended up in Boston for college — where he stumbled into fencing tryouts (literally the only ones he didn't sleep through) and ended up team captain
  • Starting running at 41 after losing 50 pounds through YouTube workouts and smaller portions — only to break his fibula on a ninja warrior structure at the park on Father's Day 🤦
  • Running his first 5K on New Year's Eve and somehow getting a Chicago Marathon bib just eight months later while training for a 10K
  • Running Chicago four years in a row (plus Bayshore) and the deliberate decision to skip it this year and cheer from the sidelines instead
  • His third Chicago Marathon, where two friends paced him the whole way — one hyping the crowd, one filming on a GoPro — and why that race changed how he thinks about running with others
  • Nutrition lessons learned the hard way: cramping at mile 14 after skipping sodium on a cold race day despite a hot training summer
  • Winning the Shamrock Shuffle Mile — with a lead car and actual tape to break — after just showing up to see what would happen
  • How he fell into the Brooks Running Collective, went to ambassador camp in Santa Monica, and found his people (and then aged out after three years)
  • Co-founding a Tuesday morning track club in Chicago with friends Kim and Conrad — because none of them had a track background but they all wanted to do speed work, so they just figured it out together
  • Being a certified run coach (through UESCA) with three athletes, all currently training for spring halfs — intentionally capping at five so he can actually show up for each of them
  • Coaching his daughter's 4th–8th grade cross country and track team at her Catholic school, where the main goal is making sure kids still like running when it's over
  • The 606 trail in Logan Square, CARA's lakefront hydration tents, and why the Chicago running community makes you feel like you belong
  • His family being scattered across the globe — parents back in Malaysia, brother in Hong Kong, sister now in Barcelona — and the very obvious reason to sign up for the Barcelona Marathon
  • Meeting his wife at a pub crawl in Wrigleyville and going on a very long first date a month later
  • Chasing a 1:40–1:42 at the Indy Mini with his friend and fellow Shokz ambassador Caroline — about 10 minutes faster than his current PR — because she believes he can do it, so now he has to

Previous Guests Mentioned

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This is a ⁠SandyBoy Productions⁠ podcast.

Episode Transcript

Keegan: I lost about 50 pounds,

got really fit. felt like I was invincible.

Maybe I'll give this running thing a try, then on Fathers Day, I broke my leg.

Ally: Welcome to Finish Lines and Milestones, a podcast for everyday runners. I'm your host, Ally Brettnacher, and if you run, you are a runner and every runner has a story. Join me each week as I share these stories and we celebrate finish lines and milestones together.

If you are looking to upgrade your smartwatch or wearables during this spring season of training for your next race, look no further than a maze fit. I personally use their balance to smartwatch for all things running, but it also has replaced my Apple Watch, so I wear it pretty much 24 7. Except I take it off when I sleep now, because I also have the Helio ring to track that for me versus wearing my watch to sleep, which I was and works great as well.

but let me tell you this, watch. The battery life is [00:01:00] my most favorite thing about it. 21 day battery life. I just went on spring break, didn't even bother bringing my charger. I knew I wouldn't need it. so that's one thing I really love. The other thing is the price point. So the Balance two watch is 2 99 and the Helio ring is one 50. So very, very competitively priced, but still has the functionality you need, want, expect from this type of technology.

Of course, there are watches with more functionality and less than the one that I use, so you can find whatever watch works best for what. You wanna use it for, so I highly recommend going to amaz fit.com, A-M-A-Z-F-I t.com, and you can use Code Ally B-A-L-L-Y-B for 10% off of your order. Thank you Amfi, for supporting this podcast. And now before I get into this week's episode, I am fresh off of Spring Break where we went to Scottsdale, Arizona and the weather was perfect, nice and warm. We even got a cloudy day where we spent a lot of time outside exploring. I got to run a couple of times, got to [00:02:00] hike, and our girls who are, you know, five and nine.

Really enjoyed it. Wanna go back already. So it was a great time to step away. I was proud of myself. I bricked my phone. If you don't know what a brick is, you should Google it, but it can basically turn your phone into a brick In my case, I use it to stay off social media and so I am on day, I think five now with not even looking at my social media, which has been really refreshing.

Sometimes just need a complete break. Not even the temptation is there. now that's an ad for Brick. now heading into the Carmel Marathon, not this weekend, but next, and this weekend is the 10 miler for the Indy Mini. And so I'm excited to be running that downtown Indianapolis.

and speaking of the Indy Mini. Lindsay Hein, who is the founder of Sandy Boy Productions, she and I are hosting an event the day before the Indy Mini. We just announced our first guest, who is Emma Grace Hurley, who we actually talk about briefly in this episode. So if you are interested in joining us for that event, whether you're local to Indy or you're coming in town for the race, check out the link in the show [00:03:00] notes to grab your ticket.

There are only 100 available. So hope to see you there, Keegan. This week's guest will be there. So a couple other things I wanna point out in this episode.

If you want more of Brook's Run collective. Hillary Burgess was also on this podcast previously, so go check out her episode and then. I also wanna point out the fact that I have a bad cold in this, so I sound like I have a cold. Thankfully, we had technical issues in the middle and I got to blow my nose, but unfortunately that meant that the second half the video's kind of wonky on key inside.

So just be warned. But the audio works. Whether you're watching or listening, I know that you'll enjoy this episode with Keegan. Keegan is getting ready this weekend. on Sunday, he's getting ready to run the Cherry Blossom 10 miler in Washington, dc. Rob Perez, who was my 150th guest, who is DC running royalty, is also running the race.

I wish I was gonna be there. Bucket list for sure. So now this week I talked to Keegan Kok, who I met really through the internet at first. And then I got to meet Keegan in person at the Indy Monumental [00:04:00] last year. And now he's coming back to Indy for the Indy Mini as well in May.

So we talk all about Keegan's Running Journey, how he started way later in life and has really. Caught the bug if you will. He's now a certified run coach. Coaches. His daughter's cross country team. Keegan is from Chicago and helped found a run club there.

He is part of Brooks running Collective, like I just mentioned. He also creates amazing content on the internet that you should go check out as well. But I know you're really gonna enjoy this conversation with Keegan.

Hi, Keegan.

Keegan: Hello, how are you, Allie?

Ally: It's so nice to see you.

Keegan: Yeah, it's been a hot minute, so it's good to, it's good to connect again.

Ally: It is, yeah. You and I got to meet in real life last November.

Keegan: We did. Oh geez. It has November feels so long ago. But yes, we met at, in your, in your, your home state, Indiana, Indianapolis, when I was down there for monumental, that was such a fun race. And the whole expo, all the events around it, I had a lot of fun that weekend.

Ally: Yeah. And tell people about how you [00:05:00] came to run that race with your team at Brooks.

Keegan: Mm-hmm. Um, yeah, so, I was part of the Brooks Running Collective, which is, basically their, their ambassador team. and they actually have a, a three year cap on the team. And so I was coming to the end of my third year, that race was also a Brooks sponsored race, so we had about. I wanna say 15 or so people, like were running that race.

some doing the half, some doing the full, which I did the half. and yeah, that was my, my last race, like as a, you know, as a Brooks ambassador. So it was kind of like a little bit of a swan song

Ally: Yeah, it was a good one.

Keegan: out a bang. I had fun. I went on a bang.

Ally: Yeah. Yeah. It was such a great weekend. So when you travel to a race with Brooks Running Collective, they have like an agenda and stuff for you too. They put together like a shakeout run and, and things like that. Right.

Keegan: Yeah, not always. but this one just happened to be one that there were just more folks going, as we also had folks [00:06:00] from, the actual like Brooks HQ who came with us as well. So this was a bigger to-do. So there was a shakeout. We had dinner together and I really felt like we were a team, like going to race, right?

started running late in life, so I didn't have the high school or like middle school, cross country track team travel type

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: But, this felt like the adult version of it. So, so that was really cool. Some of the smaller races that maybe we don't have as many folks going, then we sort of like just. Like get together and do you know, either join the shakeout or definitely like have dinner together and

Ally: Yeah. It's so fun.

Keegan: some content, make some silly

Ally: Of course. Yeah. how did you find out about BRC and how did you become a part of it?

Keegan: of fell into it to be honest. so I joined about three years ago, or two and a half years ago at this time. it was coming at a time when I was, I think I just started running. I was maybe running for about a year at that point. I was also coming at a time where like I was in between jobs, Uh, I had about like a six month period between [00:07:00] being laid off from like a job when I just said, Hey, you know what, I'm not going to, jump into next thing right away. Let me just take a breather. It's been a lot, five years at a big startup company, right? And so. was right around that time.

I was like, you know what, running's fun. Runnings been occupying my time and spending more time, you know, just putting, posting more of my running on Instagram. then I just saw the application and didn't think too much about it. I was like. Well, I have time. You know, it's like, why not just put my name in the hat?

And, um, I was honestly, a little surprised that I was picked, and definitely had all the imposter syndrome and, uh, I said yes, took the lead. And then, even the first year of being on the Brooks team, I was still, yes, you connect to a lot of ambassadors online and you engage with them, meet a lot of folks, but I was still a little unsure, but it wasn't until. Once in August of that first year when they got us all together at Santa Monica for like an ambassador retreat that I was like, oh yeah, these are my people. just bonded [00:08:00] quickly and uh, been, it's been a ride since then.

Ally: That's so cool. Yeah, I actually forgot to apply this year. I applied last year, and I was rejected. And then, this year I just totally spaced it 'cause I had been considering it. Uh, just because seeing that group of people Yeah, you're like, that looks like my people. That looks like a ton of fun. Uh, it also seems like yeah, you get the opportunities to travel to either meet altogether for a Brooks thing or you know, out at races, which is really, really cool.

Keegan: Yeah, it's definitely quite an experience. Uh, again, I've never done anything like that before. maybe only had about like a thousand, maybe less than a thousand followers at that point. So was all new to me, uh, working with brands and brand deals and stuff like that. But they, they really took care of us.

they really did a good job in like making sure we. Kind of got to know each other and engaged with each other. and then that the ambassador retreat was, pretty much mostly paid for by them. All we had to do was like, get ourselves

Ally: That's cool.

Keegan: but then once we were, there we're like sort of, you know, taken care of.

So it was, it was really nice. It was like, adult [00:09:00] summer camp, so to

Ally: Great.

Keegan: running

Ally: I am so into the idea of that, like how fun and yeah. I just think there needs to be more groups like that. I mean, you see the other ambassador programs, I don't know if I've seen one that's does it quite like Brooks does. So it just seems like a great opportunity.

Keegan: Yeah, I, I agree. Definitely just from the outside looking into doesn't, don't feel like the rest have the same approach that

Ally: Yeah. So after your three years, you roll off, can you do it again at some point or is that you do three years and that's it?

Keegan: I think you do three years and that's it. they used to not have a cap, and then you do have folks that have been there for like a

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: of time. but

Ally: I bet.

Keegan: I think they, you know, they, they wanna like. Cycle people and, you know, get some fresh perspective. So I totally get it. but that being said, though, like the, you know, friendships that I've made, whether it's with the brand or like with previous ambassadors, like. remains very strong and I've ran races with them too, like outside of the Brooks team and [00:10:00] stuff like that. So, yeah, I think, while the opportunities passed, I got a lot out of it and, you know, no regrets.

Ally: Love it. So you started running, like you said, later in life. So how did that happen?

Keegan: so I started running. At age 41, I

Ally: Wow.

Keegan: wanna say right around there. and I, I think, maybe a classic late in life run story, was never really big into running. might have done a couple of sprints in PE class and that's about it. but I think what happened was right around, maybe even just before the pandemic, I was just. I was getting very sedentary and, before you knew it, you started to put on a lot more weight. And, for me, I think with the pandemic was a little bit of a wake up call. Like, well, okay, have a little bit more time in my hands. Let's try to do something about it.

Started with just, Home workouts consumed a lot of YouTube,

Ally: wow.

Keegan: nutrition and like, didn't do anything crazy. Honestly. I just ate slightly smaller portions and I was just mindful of what I was doing. and I lost a lot of weight. I lost about 50 pounds,

Ally: Awesome.[00:11:00]

Keegan: got really fit. and then felt like I was invincible.

I'm like, oh, okay. Like, let's, let's take on a new challenge. always hated running. Maybe I'll give this running thing a try, kind of. had my mindset committed to it. This is probably like, you know, June-ish, right? then on Fathers Day, I broke my leg.

Ally: What Keegan, how did this happen?

Keegan: again, uh, feeling invincible, feeling really fit.

I was playing with my kids at a park that had this sort of ninja warrior type

Ally: Oh, no.

Keegan: kind of jumped wrong, landed wrong, and broke my, like left, the smaller bone fibula, I

Ally: Okay.

no.

Keegan: so then I was like, oh, okay, well that, that was. Pause on, the running thing.

Ally: Did you wear a cast for that? Like what did you have to do to rehab that?

Keegan: yeah, fortunately no surgery, they said oh, just let the bone heal on its own. so, and I was like, okay. It was actually kind of fascinating to just see like how the bone just sort of repairs itself, you know? Um. Bizarre. but then, came that winter when I [00:12:00] was actually, moving again.

I was like, all right, let me give this running thing a try. found a program, like that had a strength and like running component. It was like, dude, for 30 days and you'll run your first 5K. I'm like, no way. Like, it's not possible. But I did it, I ran my first 5K, which was, new Year's Eve that same year.

Ally: Wow.

Keegan: there was a 5K like, that morning to kind of kick off the new year. and then had a lot of fun. didn't think I could do it, but I did it. and then, you know, caught the bug.

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: my, both my kids and my wife were there too. They're like, you know, and, and I think my kids all, when they were a little younger than back then, They also kind of caught the bug. They're like, wait, get a medal for this. I'm like, I kinda wanna do this, you know? so, so that kind of started, my running journey. and then, you know, they, they joined in a couple of races too, so it was a fun like, you know,

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: thing for a little

Ally: absolutely. And do you have two girls, right? Two girls. And how old are they?

Keegan: Uh, one's 13, another is about 11 and a half,

Ally: Okay,

Keegan: months

Ally: so you're gonna have two teenagers at the [00:13:00] same time.

Keegan: I know, I know. I really have one.

Ally: Right?

Keegan: so far it's been

Ally: That's good.

Keegan: We'll see what happens when I get to,

Ally: I know. I, I'm the oldest of three girls and then I have two daughters, and so I, I'm just terrified of the teenage years. we'll see how they go, but yeah.

Keegan: You're getting, you're getting there too.

Ally: Yep. Yep. So, that's so fun to be able to share the sport with them too. And so at what point did you graduate from that 5K that you did to then being like, okay, now I'm gonna run a marathon or a half, or how did the progression work for you?

Keegan: it escalated quickly. So, that was, you know, my first 5K was that New Year's Eve. And, I wanna say about eight months after that, I actually was fortunate enough to get a bib for the Chicago Marathon, and I was part of me. I was like, well, I had no intentions of running a marathon at that point.

I was actually in midst of training for 10 k.

Ally: Oh my gosh.

Keegan: progressing, you know? but part of it was like, well, you know, just like, starting, it [00:14:00] was around that time of starting to like get into to meeting the running community and stuff like that. The first six months, seven months of my running journey, it's really just me running on my own. Going to races with my family. didn't really know there was a Chicago running scene. but once I kind of got introduced, and started learning more about, run clubs and marathon, and I was like, oh, turns out this is a really hard bit to get, so maybe I should

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: And,

Ally: my gosh,

Keegan: so I did. I did.

I honestly wasn't, It wasn't probably the best path, but it was, I didn't go from zero

Ally: right?

Keegan: was really, I was like 10 K train, right? and also with a little bit of delusion and negativity, I, I finished,

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: and I had a blast. then I told myself like, okay, I think I'm gonna do it again next

Ally: Wow.

Keegan: And I

Ally: Wow. How, how did you get that Chicago bib, by the way? Was it through work or how did that happen?

Keegan: Actually, no, I have to give a lot of credit to the first run group that brought me into the Chicago running scene was a group called Family Style rc. they were [00:15:00] very focused on bringing more representation to the sport. and um, I don't know where it came from, but they, they got some bibs through the organizers.

I think the program's kind of evolved into what is called entries for equity now.

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: But before it was essentially just like, Hey, we wanna, promote the sport we wanna bring, more diversity into the sport. And that's how I got the bib.

Ally: Wow. Crazy. And then you've run it, have you run it every year since then? Is that right?

Keegan: Every year

Ally: Yeah. Wow.

Keegan: uh, for Chicagos, and then I did a, the Bayshore marathon as well last year. So five in

Ally: Wow.

Keegan: But I'm not gonna run it this year. I, I've made a very deliberate, decision of Hey, I've done it four years in a row now. gained so much and I've taken in so much from the community. I've made conscious decision to, like, I'm gonna set up, out there with my run group, we'll set up a cheer zone and I'm gonna be on the sidelines cheering, so I can't

Ally: Spectating is also so rewarding and so much fun. You're gonna, you'll love that.

Keegan: [00:16:00] fun.

Ally: Yeah. I, I really applaud you, Keegan, for taking Taking a year off, being like, I don't wanna do it this year, I'm gonna take a break. Because you can, I feel like the internet makes you feel like, okay, everybody's doing marathons every weekend all the time.

If I'm a runner, I need to be running marathons. It's like, actually, no. You don't even have to race if you're a runner. You just have to run. That's all you have to do. So I applaud you for,

Keegan: yeah,

Ally: a break from the marathon.

Keegan: yeah. That's the thing. Last year I was very intentional with like, I. Hey, I'm gonna train for two marathons. I was gonna do a spring and I fall. prior to that, I've always only just ran one marathon a year, the Chicago Marathon and, had some lofty goals. Like, somehow I had in my head I'm like, oh, maybe I'm in like, you know, a sub four marathon shape.

even after running my first marathon with vaccination four 40, I'm like, oh, I think I can do a sub four.

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: all do that,

Ally: We do.

Keegan: I, it was very intentional last year where I'm like, Hey, I'm gonna take this marathon training seriously worked with my coach and we put two solid blocks together. chasing that time, I have, haven't quite gotten yet, but I think I'm [00:17:00] close. so not quite as set for marathon yet. but despite that, after that two solid blocks and, and honestly, my original goal to start a year last year was Really to like survive those two blocks and not get injured.

Right? And, and yes, I would've loved to hit a time goal, then when I look back, I'm like, no. I kind of told myself like, I wanna see if I can do two marathons in a year. And I did. and so I could have gone into, 2026 going like, all right, let's continue to build and chase that goal. but I think I told myself no, you know, like. Let's take a year off. maybe we'll do some shorter races, some faster races. I'm still gonna continue to run and train. but I altered my goal for 26 as like, I'm not chasing a time goal per se. but I've gained so much just from like, running with others and others who willing to run with me to achieve my goals. And I told myself like, you know what, maybe this is the year that I run races with friends, doesn't matter [00:18:00] how it, could be me helping somebody pay somebody to their goals. it could be, Hey, somebody wants to run with me and help me, like, hit my goal. Sure. or with, in, in the case of an upcoming race, in the mini I'm gonna be running with a friend who, we're both kind of chasing a very scary goal and we've kind of committed to like run together. So that's a goal for 26. Just run more races with friends, you know.

Ally: I love that so much. I really do. I think it gets so stressful. And, and I think it can deplete the joy a little bit if you put too much pressure on yourself. Chasing times only. I, I'm competitive. I love chasing times and chasing my best, but also, being mindful of the fact that not every single race or every year has to be about that.

Keegan: to be.

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: Mm-hmm.

Ally: yay. I wanna talk a little bit about your Chicago Marathon experiences. So,

Keegan: Yeah.

Ally: so you kind of got into the running club scene for your first Chicago. Did you, I can't remember if you already said this, did you have a coach or you just Googled a plan?

Keegan: Uh, for my [00:19:00] first two Chicagos, no, very much just self-coach figuring out myself, you know, and, uh, whatever plan I found and so forth. and then, so as you can imagine, the first one, I had a ton of fun. I completed. The second one I kind of told myself, all right, let's, uh, you've done one.

Now let's try to chase for, uh, you know, a time goal. train myself, self coach that way. and that the second one didn't, quite go the way I wanted. I think made some nutrition mistakes and started cramping at mile

Ally: Oh no.

Keegan: bit of a, a struggle just to get across the line, but I still did, you know.

and then, the third marathon was when I, started working with a coach and I've been working with her since then. so that's really my first foray into working with a coach, you know? and that third Chicago Marathon was actually, uh, went really well. really special as well for me. not just from the training perspective, but also I had two friends, Mike, who was part of [00:20:00] the Brooks team as well, as well as Matt, who's like a local here, friend of mine. Who both, uh, you know, were willingly like and gracious and said they wanna run with me and they were gonna pace me. And so we had such a blast. The three of us ran the whole thing together. Matt was always a little bit up ahead, like hyping up the crowd for

Ally: Aw.

Keegan: Uh, that, and then, and Mike, you know, had his GoPro, so he was shooting

Ally: Oh, that's so fun.

Keegan: just trying to survive, you know, but. but it was a cool memory.

honestly, a lot of what I mentioned about wanting to run more others, really stemmed from that race. I'm like, okay, like, they did this for me. I wanna kind of do this for others. I wanna capture more of that,

Ally: Yeah. Yeah.

Keegan: yeah. that was two years ago, so that was 20, 24 Chicago Marathon.

Yeah.

Ally: Okay. And then how has the weather been on the races for you? I was trying to remember the recent years.

Keegan: Um, the first two was really nice, like 40,

Ally: perfect.

Keegan: kind of perfect weather, so to speak. the race, is decent. It just got a little hot [00:21:00] towards the end, but decent weather, I think last year really strong till like 18 miles. and then I think it got a little hot, and then I was just like, all right, trying to get to the line, you know? you know, the weather in Chicago, it's, it's really like hit or

Ally: Yes.

Keegan: you know, There's not much you can do about weather. It's what I've learned. It's just like, how do you just, give your best out there given the

Ally: Right.

Keegan: you,

Ally: Yeah, totally. To, absolutely. It's hard. Um, for nutrition, you mentioned the mistakes that you've made. how do you treat nutrition now? What do you use? What's worked for you?

Keegan: so in terms of gels, I use Huma a lot.

Ally: Oh, that's right. Yeah.

Keegan: sometimes, yeah, sometimes I'll use Morton as well. Uh, that's also worked well with me. Morton's just so expensive. I'm like,

Ally: expensive. Yeah.

Keegan: I'm like, you know, so, so I've been like, uh, leaning on humor more. Um, I've tried some other ones that just haven't worked with my gut.

So

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: found that like works, I just kind of stick to it. I think what I've learned though from that, uh, second marathon was really more of like the

Ally: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Keegan: [00:22:00] that was a really hot summer leading up to that race and every training run, I made sure I had a lot of sodium drinks the night before or like, during or before that. and then came race day, the temps dropped down to like 40 degrees. I'm like, oh, this is perfect. Like Amy, I've been training in like hot summer this, like, is perfect. I'm good. but then realized like, no, I still still need it. The sodium, you know.

Ally: Yeah, I've had that, gosh, it was monumental maybe a couple years ago when I was running the marathon and I, cramped like mile one Keegan. I was like, what? This cannot, this cannot be the way this race starts. And I, I ran into, I literally ran into a friend of mine who had salt stick tablets.

She's like, would you like some sodium? And I'm like, yes, please. So she saved my race. I credit her for a lot of that race, going a lot better than it could have had. I continued, wanting sodium and cramping throughout the race. But yeah, it's so important. what do you use, do you use salt?

Sick like capsules or, chewables.

Keegan: I've used sausage chewables, quite a bit. I still have quite a, quite a bit, in stock. lately I've been [00:23:00] using, the runway salty carbs, which I quite

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: so it's kind of, it's uh, it's a powder form, so mix into drink. It comes

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: grams of carbs, and I wanna say 500. Milligrams of sodium or so.

Um, so, works out quite well. yeah, it's a combination of salt stick, runway, salty

Ally: So do you carry a belt with you or a handheld? do you just do it before?

Keegan: I do, I do a lot of it

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: Last summer was really hot as well, so I trained with a handheld quite a bit. I didn't really, I didn't really like running

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: running a

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: you know? so normally I would have a flip belt that would have like a bottle across the waist, um,

Ally: Gotcha.

Keegan: I'll carry that, I think. The last Chicago marathon that I did, I did start with a handheld and then I, I like just tossed it when I was done and I, I, I've had that handheld for almo, like almost two training cycles. I'm like, okay, it's probably gross now. Anyways. It's probably time to go

Ally: I've been there.

Keegan: it to

Ally: Right? You're like, this is pretty gross. I don't know how many times I've actually washed [00:24:00] it.

Keegan: yeah. Yeah.

Ally: Uh, yeah, what other races have you done? I know recently you just did the Shamrock Shuffle in Chicago.

Keegan: Yeah.

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: Uh, that's, that's a special one too for me too. so a little bit of context. The Shamrock Shuffle, uh, is always around mid-March, right? close to San Patty stay, and It's kind of the unofficial start of like the racing season for Chicago. either folks are trained through winter or they, or they'll start the sha truffle and they'll start training for like races and stuff like that. and it draws a big crowd. think maybe there was about like. 30,000 folks running the eight K on

Ally: Wow.

Keegan: it feels a little bit like a mini Chicago marathon.

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: it starts around the same area too, you

Ally: Wow,

Keegan: but what I really liked about it is, it's actually a, for me, it's a two day event.

They have a a mile race on Saturday and then the eight K, which the one that almost everybody does, on Sunday. and I started. That same year where I started racing and [00:25:00] running my first 5K, you know, few months after that, was the Shamrock Shuffle. And I mentioned earlier, like, you know, my kids were like, oh, you get a medal for like doing races.

So they wanted to get into it. So we actually did the Shamrock Shuffle Mile as a family.

Ally: that's so fun.

Keegan: unfortunately my wife was sick that

Ally: Oh.

Keegan: so she couldn't do it, so she was on the sidelines. which actually, It turned out great because I was running with my older daughter, like close to the front. my younger daughter was a little bit behind, and after she crossed the finish line, you know, my wife was there and I still recall her telling me I'm like. Caitlin had this glow on her face, is this post run high? Uh, and she could tell like, oh, okay. Like, I think there's some running in her future. and my wife used to run, she ran in high school and college and kind of stopped. and then here I come like years later, I'm like, oh, I'm picking a running. And she's like,

Ally: Yeah. She's like, wait a.

Keegan: Yeah. But, but that was, especially in a way that, that was kind of like the, you know, the first race for my daughters and like our first kind of family race. [00:26:00] and you know, so that was the mile and then I did the ak. but to me for that weekend, the, the mile has always been special. Because that was the first year, the second year that we did the mile. I sort of noticed, I'm like, oh, I think I'm getting, you know, in pretty good shape. I'm like, let's just, try to, try to race it and see how it goes. and then, I had a pretty decent time. I think I finished it in like seven 20 or so, and I was like, oh, this is fun. You know, I'm like, maybe the third year I'll actually train for a mile. And

Ally: my gosh,

Keegan: to erase it and see what happens. and, and I did. And, um. That was actually the year I won the mile.

Ally: so cool.

Keegan: so cool, especially, you know, for, uh, someone to me who's very middle of the pack, who again, never ran in high school or college, so never really had the experience of like leading a race or winning a race. and I also live in Chicago. It's a big city, so it's not like I have age group podiums you know, folks in my age group are still way faster than

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: so that race, I recall was like. You I kind of ran [00:27:00] it, there's a competitive wave and a recreational wave. So I ran a recreational wave. So there's some kids up front who's

Ally: Yeah. Yeah.

Keegan: know, I'm like, okay, cool, let them go. but then, before you knew it, like by halfway I realized I was front.

I was like, oh, is an interesting experience. and there was a lead car in front

Ally: Wow.

Keegan: Wow, this is what it

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: like. you know, and I was like, all right, let's keep, keep going. stay in there. and then obviously miles hard by like the. 75% away. I felt somebody breeding hard next to

Ally: Boy.

Keegan: like, oh, no. but fortunately I was able to kick towards the end and, and yeah, it was this first time ever winning a race, first time breaking tape.

Ally: There was tape too. That's the best.

Keegan: tape too. So it was, it was such a, it was such an experience, you know, and I, again, I had no, I didn't, think, I didn't even know, my time was like in range. It just happened to be like, you know, it was who, that was the field that I was given and that was the field that just happened to be there and now I'll cherish that

Ally: yeah.

Keegan: know?

Ally: That's really special. What was your time [00:28:00] for that? For the winning time,

Keegan: 6 55, I would

Ally: gosh, subset and to, and this year. Spoiler alert. You did, you upped that time.

Keegan: I did, I did. Yeah. I think I, I 33 maybe.

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: Right around there. Yeah.

Ally: Wow.

Keegan: So,

Ally: terrifying to me. Actually,

Keegan: Yeah,

Ally: don't know. I've, I've not raced a mile. I don't know if I've ever raced a mile, so it sounds so scary. 'cause five Ks also scare me because you're, if you're racing them, you're running a much faster pace than you are for a half or a marathon. And so, we'll see, we have a mile race here that, the same organization that puts on the CNO monumental Marathon puts on a mile race that now has a 5K too.

But we do that as a family every year. So ever since

Keegan: Yeah,

Ally: was part of the team there on the board, I, we've done it. And so my, since my girls were little, they've done it and it's so fun. I mean, it might take us 15 or 20 minutes, but it's cool to just kind of get them in that environment. So that's my excuse for not, for not racing it.

Yeah.

Keegan: I'll give you not [00:29:00] two more years. When they're a little older

Ally: Oh.

Keegan: then you almost have to

Ally: Right. Just, yeah, I mean, for real, that will be a problem for me, for sure. My, my oldest is, gonna be nine, and she's quick. She will be, I hope she'll be a runner if she wants to be, but we shall see.

Keegan: yeah, that's the think too

was trying very hard to like, you know, obviously I'm passionate about it. My wife's passionate about it, but didn't wanna, you know. Push too much. You know, I'm like, I'm gonna expose you to it, and if you wanna continue, great.

Ally: right?

Keegan: if you don't, that's fine

Ally: Yes.

Keegan: my younger daughter has really gotten to the point where she, she's staunchly saying, no, I hate running.

Ally: And you're like, okay,

Keegan: but she's, yeah, but she's the competitive dancer, so she

Ally: that's right.

Keegan: her, like,

Ally: Wow.

Keegan: her, uh, her sport, her mindset, everything else is like secondary to her. Even if she plays volleyball at her school, it's like, okay, cool. Love boss was great, but I can't get injured 'cause I need

Ally: Need to dance. Yeah. Wow.

Keegan: but my older daughter though, she does, you know, she still participates in my [00:30:00] cross country at

Ally: Okay. Yeah.

Keegan: at school. you know, I think every once in a while, like, you know, if I ask her like, you wanna go for run, she'll say yes.

but if I don't, she'll just be, oh, that's, that's cool. I don't need to run unless I'm in a cross country season.

Ally: Yeah. Are you, did I remember correctly? Yeah. You coach now too for your girls

Keegan: Yes.

Ally: oldest.

Keegan: do. Yeah. I started, about four years ago now. Right around the same time, I think I started running and that was the year that the school actually, think they joined a new sports league, and so cross country was new, as well as track and, again, Catholic school very like volunteer base and it's like, who raises their hand, you know? so I started coaching with the principal at that time. but as you can imagine as a principal, you have a lot of responsibility. So she, you know, she faded back a little bit and, uh,

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: up coaching the team and, and all the kids loved it. they came back the next year for cross country.

They joined track in the spring. so

Ally: That's so fun.

Keegan: uh, ever [00:31:00] since, and grade to eighth grade. So you get a whole variety, you know, fourth grade you gotta wrangle them a little bit. Eighth grade, sometimes a little too cool for

Ally: Yep. Yep. I could see that.

Keegan: uh, but it's been fun and, and it's, Well, it's a heavy commitment. Tends to be short, right? Like they, we usually have like, geez, only like four, three to four weeks of practice at most usually. And then, bam, bam, bam, tree meets and we're

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: Same with track as well. so it always feels very compressed. but, you know, at the end of the day my, my main goal is to. sure the kids like actually like it

Ally: Yes. Right.

Keegan: later. Right. And so it's not so much about getting them to state or anything like that. It's more of it's come have fun and, and cheer each other on. Um, and then we, we've gotten, we've gotten better too over the years, like in the first year. We showed up. We like bandaid, bears didn't know like how the meets

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: like that. but yeah, the last two years we've had a few meets where the, the boys team have won, meets. So they get to see a trophy, hold a trophy. So it's [00:32:00] been fun.

Ally: that's really fun. Yeah. you also are a running coach too, like A-R-R-C-A certified, is that the right acronym?

Keegan: Correct, correct. So, uh, I'm actually certified with a

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: um, called, uh, U-E-S-C-A, United Endurance Sports Coaching Association. Maybe don't quote me on that, but it's

Ally: It sound, that sounds right.

Keegan: got the

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: but, uh, but I became a certified run coach. About a year ago. it was something that I've been meaning to do. from multiple perspectives. Like I enjoyed a sport. I've had fun coaching the younger kids, you know, so to me it's like just learning and knowledge, right? Like, what can I do to better

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: but then at the same time, I also like.

just passionate about coaching. And I was like, all right, well, maybe this can apply to like coaching friends and adults too. so I started about a year ago. and I think you, you mentioned RRCA. The reason I didn't go the RCA route was when I was doing my research, the RCA routes.

typically you just go in on like a weekend and you get it done. [00:33:00] and to me that felt To compressed.

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: if I retained that much. so I picked, I picked the U-U-E-S-C-A one because you go at your own time, you just go through all the modules, you get tested in with the modules and things like that. and so that worked better for me it could have got done faster, but I don't know if I would have learned as

Ally: Right. Right. I mean, that's, that is an interesting point to think about. Somebody going in, in like, in like a day and a half, they feel, you know, like, oh, I'm ready to coach everybody. And you're like, well, I, I, for me personally, I don't know that I would retain enough in that short amount of time either. I didn't know there was another option.

I guess that makes sense that there would be more than one organization, but that's really cool.

Keegan: Yeah. but, uh, but it's been great. I also, again, it's, it's more of a passion and I'm not necessarily out here trying to build like a coaching business or anything like that. Right. I try to take on no more than like four or five athletes at a time. so currently I have three athletes that I'm working with who are, actually all three of them are working, are doing a half marathon soon, a [00:34:00] spring half marathon. so kind of, it's kind of nice. It just ended up that way

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: folks that I'm helping with are like working on halves. and then, yeah, I mean, I could probably take one or two more, but. And I don't really wanna do more than five just 'cause I wanna make sure, that I am giving, you know, equal time and, and, and commitment whoever I'm working with as

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: Yeah.

Ally: yeah. Absolutely. Well, and you have a full-time job, so

Keegan: I do

Ally: right, you're, yeah.

Keegan: time

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: family, and I'm training, I'm, I'm running myself too,

Ally: Right.

Keegan: I, I wanna make sure we're, you

Ally: Yeah, absolutely. That's so much, that's incredible that you do all that. Yeah. The dance dad, I'm sure that, that becomes difficult. When do you travel for that, for your daughter's dance?

Keegan: Yeah,

we, we do, fortunately right now most of her, competitions are regional.

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: the furthest we've gone is, across state lines is to Milwaukee,

Ally: Okay. Yeah.

Keegan: some of the other competitions, they may say Chicago, but they may be out in the, you know. The burbs or maybe an hour drive or [00:35:00] so.

So they all within like an hour to two drive maximum so far. I think as this is her fourth season now, but as she continues to like progress into higher level teams, maybe we may have more

Ally: Right.

Keegan: future,

Ally: Yeah. Yeah.

Keegan: Yeah,

Ally: you also have, is this right? Did I find that you used to do fencing?

Keegan: I

Ally: Okay. How cool is that? How? Okay. I wanna hear about how you end up doing that.

Keegan: Sure, sure. so, a little bit back history. I, I grew up in Malaysia, and

Ally: Wow.

Keegan: I spent about a year in Hong Kong, just before college. 'cause my parents moved there. and from there, you know, I was applying to schools in the us. so got into a school in Boston.

That's where I went to college. And, the reason I bring that up is that, again, a little bit of negativity and like delusions. I have always grew up watching movies about American colleges, TV I'm like, oh, it would be really fun to join like a, a college team. maybe I could join the football team. [00:36:00] never played football in my life, never thrown a football like, you know, it's, it's soccer back home, right? But again, a little delusion activity. I'm like, oh, let's, let's go to tryouts. You know, we'll see what happens. I slept in, missed the tryouts, missed the tryouts for all the other sports as well. but the fencing tryouts was in the evening that same day, so I'm like. let me show up and let's see what this is about. Right. and uh, so that's how I got onto the team. and that was my, my foray into fencing. And obviously it started from like, from scratch. And, so we were Title IX school, so the Girls team university varsity, the, the men's team was club, but both coaches know each other well.

So we kind of trained together,

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: know, But yeah, just, uh, you know, the first year or two was mostly sitting on the bench, but just like learning. but then, yeah, and then I, uh, ended up being captain in the third year, fence. and I actually studied abroad in Scotland in my junior

Ally: Oh, cool.

Keegan: a semester. actually became a better fencer in Scotland because it was a pass fail, study [00:37:00] abroad. So I'm like, okay, I just need to show up to classes. but ended up joining a fencing club there and I got coached there. Um, and, and yeah, that was my fencing journey. I fenced

Ally: What.

Keegan: col in college for four years, after college. No longer on a team. Fencing is a little bit like running in a way. Like in the team, way that it's works is like, let's say you have one school fencing the other, um, you kind of have tree fencers, go against the other fencers.

And then you You get hit five times, then you're out, your next fence comes in. It's a little bit like a relay

Ally: interesting.

Keegan: to 15 points, you know? so it's like a very much a team collegiate event. and then you come outta college and all of a sudden you don't have a team anymore. but there are all these fencing tournaments, but now you're like. You know, you're fencing as an individual, uh, and there's like rankings as well. You gain points, you move up in rankings. So it's very much like running in a way where like, yes, I imagine if you were on the college team, you're like, are running for points,

Ally: yeah.

Keegan: top five and cross country scores, right? And then you come outta college and all of a sudden you're like, oh, I'm [00:38:00] running for my own prs and like, what's happening, right?

so there's some parallels there, but I, I fence, on my own for about. Uh, I would say off and on for about like six to eight years after college.

Um,

Ally: so wild.

Keegan: uh, yeah, and then, and then I just, I dunno what happened. I just kind of stopped. still have all my gear, so once in a while I'll show up, you

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: but yeah, have not,

Ally: Wild.

Keegan: made it a priority yet, you know?

Ally: But it's so, that's such an interesting sport.

How did you show up to the tryouts? did you have no gear? They just, you put on gear and just they tell you what to do. I mean,

Keegan: Yeah, no gear. You just show up. Did some running, like baseline to baseline, all that

Ally: okay.

Keegan: just to measure raw fitness. Then they gear you up and they put you, and they, they give you a couple of pointers and if you're interested, then you come back and practice the next day, and then you slowly start to get better and better at it.

But yeah, the, the school took care of all the gear. I didn't buy my own stuff to like maybe junior college when I knew, I was like, oh. actually, no, I don't, I don't think I bought my own stuff till like after [00:39:00] college. I think even when I went to Scotland, I, brought some of the club,

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: with me over there, you know?

Ally: That's so cool. What a cool thing. I mean, I've never tried it. I don't know if I've ever actually watched it. Maybe a little bit when it's in the Olympics, but yeah. That's really interesting and especially to play collegiately.

I wanted to talk a little bit more about your international upbringing. Did you say how old you were when you moved from Malaysia to Hong Kong?

Keegan: Yeah, I was. 16,

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: 17 or so, uh, when I moved to Hong Kong. so I grew up in Malaysia, my parents were, my grandparents were originally from China on both

Ally: Okay,

Keegan: so we're Chinese by descent, but, Malaysian Chinese, right when we were, nationality wise in Malaysia.

So I grew up in Malaysia, and then right around 16, my dad got a job in Hong Kong. So the family moved. but at that point in the Malaysian school system, I had one more year of school left for like, so-called high school slash secondary school. And I said, Hey, let me just finish this year out. I still wanna

Ally: great.

Keegan: [00:40:00] final year,

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: so, um, and

Ally: I.

Keegan: I ended up staying in our, in our house with my grandparents for a year. And then once I finished out school in Malaysia, I went to Hong Kong to join the family and, did. Uh, there for like a year or two under a different system. and then, it was an international school 'cause they were expats when we were expats when we were there. that was when I got exposed to like, some, some really smart kids and they were all applying to like fancy colleges in the US and the uk and. Maybe again, some delusion and negativity. I'm like, oh, I guess I'll do the same.

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: and that's how, that's how I I made my way to the us.

So I came here for college as a freshman.

Ally: Yeah. So for people like myself who, have never been to Malaysia and don't know what it's like there, what was it like growing up in Malaysia? Like paint a picture of, I mean, I, I don't even know the t typography or the cities or

Keegan: Mm-hmm.

Ally: People what that's like.

 

Marker

Whitney Heins: Hey, I want to briefly interrupt this amazing episode to tell you about another podcast that might be right up your alley. I'm Whitney Heins and [00:41:00] I host the Mother Runners, a podcast for moms who run, which features in depth and fun interviews with mother runners. I wanted to create this show to share each other's story so we can lift each other up, but also learn, grow, and be inspired.

My hope is that it will motivate and entertain you while on the run in the car line or folding the laundry. Now let's get back to the episode.

Ally: what was it like growing up in Malaysia? Like paint a picture of, I mean, I, I don't even know the t typography or the cities or

Keegan: Mm-hmm.

Ally: People what that's like.

 

Keegan: So, I, I grew up in, uh, Kuala Lumpur, it's a capital city of, uh, Malaysia, just outside of it. and Malaysia itself, it's on equator, so weather-wise, hot and humid. almost too hot, too

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: Um, but growing up in Malaysia though, it's, uh, because I lived in the city and I kind of always seen myself as like a, a city slicker, like I've always Lived in big

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: Um,

Ally: I.

Keegan: it's not that different from maybe living in like a New York City, but, just a slightly diff, you know, different environment. I think what Malaysia is really known [00:42:00] for or what we pride ourselves is, there's really good food in Malaysia and, think everybody in Malaysia, like, you know, it's like that food like kind, brings us together and, and like, you know, a lot of community like rolls around like food and getting together for food. but it doesn't have to be fancy either. Some of the best foods in Malaysia is what you get on the streets or like restaurants that are like open air and like just, right next to the street, sorry, we're not talking like five star Michelin or anything like that. but, you know, good food quality, so.

Ally: What types? Um,

Keegan: about Malaysia.

Ally: yeah, I bet. What types of food, like on the street for an example, like what would you buy.

Keegan: Um, a lot of noodles, uh, a lot of rice as well. so Malaysia itself, is made up of tree main, like ethnic groups. Um, the malaise who were always there originally, um, right around, you know, the silk traders. So there were a lot Indian traders that moved to Malaysia, Chinese, from China who moved to Malaysia. So you kinda almost get this blend of like Chinese food with. The curry element that comes from the, the [00:43:00] Malay cuisine or the Indian cuisine. so a lot of rice, a lot of, a lot of noodles. so, very carb heavy. but yeah, so think, think of it as like a blend of like, almost like an Indian and, and Chinese food, kind of is probably the, the best way, to

Ally: Yum.

Keegan: it for somebody who like hasn't been in Malaysia, you know?

Ally: Yeah, that sounds so good. Are is fruit, I imagine the equator like a lot of fruit there.

Keegan: Yeah. Yeah. So oftentimes like, you know, when you think of dessert here, you're thinking like, you know, a pie or like something cold, like ice cream. And so, right. but for us in Malaysia, dessert is usually, fruit,

Ally: Yeah, I bet it's so good.

Keegan: it's mangoes,

Ally: Uh, yes.

Keegan: Local fruits are there, you know, like Raman.

So.

Ally: Yum. Yes. That's making me so hungry. So then you moved to Hong Kong. are your parents still living? Are they in Hong Kong?

Keegan: They're not anymore. after they retired, they moved back to Malaysia. So

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: Malaysia right now. and, and they, , they tend, they usually [00:44:00] try to come every two years or so. So, and when they come, they stay for a few months. Um, so they can spend time with my girls. Um, they don't care about us anymore.

It's all about the grandkids. Right. but yeah, so they're back in Malaysia. my brother, I have a brother and a sister, my brother do. Was living with me in Chicago for a little bit after college, and then he got a job in Asia and he's now like settled in Hong Kong. So he's still in Hong Kong. then my younger sister, was working in Boston for a little bit. She actually went to the same college I did and then she ended up working admissions office for a few years after

Ally: Oh wow. Yeah.

Keegan: Then she worked in Boston for a bit, then she got a job in Taiwan. and most recently she got a job in Barcelona, so she's out in Spain.

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: gone out to see her yet. but, I gotta find an excuse to like go out to Barcelona,

Ally: Yeah, it's like Google's, when is the Barcelona Marathon?

Keegan: Yeah, it, it just passed actually because she was messaging. I'm like, Hey, are you coming next year? I'm like, oh.

Ally: Yeah, that'd be a good excuse. Or maybe like a half marathon or [00:45:00] whatever. Yeah, that would be really fun. Wow. Wow. Your family is everywhere. My goodness. Yeah. Yeah.

Keegan: it's, uh, there's pro pros and cons to it. Obviously it would be great to have folks that are close by, you know. But, we, we connect a lot on, uh, you know, group chats and

Ally: Mm-hmm. And what language do you speak in Malaysia?

Keegan: So I went to school, uh, learning Malay, which

Ally: okay?

Keegan: the national language there sounds a lot like Indonesian. and then in a way, like English was second language, right? I only

Ally: Mm-hmm.

Keegan: of English class a week. Everything was in Malay. I learned math in Malay, chemistry in Malay, et cetera, et

Ally: Yep.

Keegan: and then, from my, Chinese descent, we, we speak Cantonese at

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: So, you can't read or write. Chinese too. Well, but verbally, I speak Cantonese. I used to be able to read and write Malay really well, but I just haven't used

Ally: Right. Yeah.

Keegan: Still talk and read, you

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: of course English, so,

Ally: Have you taken your girls to Malaysia?

Keegan: Yeah, they've been a

Ally: Oh, that's [00:46:00] so cool.

Keegan: I think we were there last summer when my sister got married as well, so that was a big trip. We're trying to make another trip, like either tail end of this year or next summer.

Ally: That's really cool. So where did you meet your wife? Where did she come in?

Keegan: we met Chicago actually, after, we were in our, it was late twenties for me, and I think she, she was 30 that, that year I was 27.

She was 30. and we actually met at a, a pup crawl in like Wrigleyville,

Ally: Oh,

Keegan: is this.

Ally: so romantic.

Keegan: party bar scene outside of the, the Cub Stadium,

Ally: Mm-hmm.

Keegan: Uh, and yeah, that's how we met. Uh, and then we just started talking. Um, and we actually didn't go on our first date for like three or four weeks after that.

Just, uh, things came up. actually had to fly back to Malaysia too for a short period of time. Um, but we kept in touch and then, uh, we went on our first date and I was like, oh, okay. I think we then we knew, you know, like we knew there was something there.

So again, we didn't, we didn't go out for a date till, [00:47:00] uh, maybe four or five weeks after, you know, we, we first met, but we were already chatting and talking and, uh, so there's always a little bit of like, on both sides, like, okay, is this, uh, you know, how is this gonna go?

Right?

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: But, uh, but the, the date. Went well. It was a really long date. It just kept going. Uh, and then I think we kind of knew like, okay, there's something here.

Ally: Yep. And the rest is history.

Keegan: The rest is history. Yep.

Ally: Um, I wanna talk more about Chicago and the running scene in particular.

Keegan: Yes.

Ally: Because there's a huge running scene there, obviously. and there's so many clubs and you've mentioned one of 'em, the family style and then you helped start another club that we talked about before we hit record. So could you just kind of give us a lay of the land in terms of your Chicago running community experience?

Keegan: Yeah. So, uh, as I mentioned, I was probably started running on my own for the first six, seven months, uh, before even being exposed to the running community. and then I ended up, or I should say family style, [00:48:00] found me and, uh, started like running with them more, um, right through their events and met a lot of friends through there.

and they were also really good about like kind of sharing like what other clubs are doing and when,

Ally: That's nice.

Keegan: It started branching out. And just visiting other clubs and, um. You know, really just getting to know the community, um, and everybody's so welcoming and it just kind of brings you in. Yes. Every, every club kind maybe have a little different focus.

Right. one other club that I run with quite a bit, especially during summer, they meet every Fridays at 6:40 AM and they always meet at a different coffee shop in the west town of Chicago. and it's always like three miles around 10 30 pace. so, but the whole point is like, you know, just kind of meet.

They start off a Friday and then you have some coffee, and then you start, start your day, right? So the every club has their, their kind of own thing. for me, uh, what ended up happening was two other friends We were realizing that okay, we do, we are chasing, we wanna, you know, get better.

We [00:49:00] wanna get prs. but again, none of us had like a track background, but we're like, okay, well let's, let's, we still wanna do track workouts. We see them on plans and so forth. So we started meeting on Tuesdays, 5 45 around that time. And partly because, know, one, I wanna make sure we get done before I had to go home and get the kids ready to school, et cetera,

Ally: Yep.

Keegan: Right? so that was about two years ago. We just started meeting at a track. and then that just kind of grew. More friends showed up. and so we kind of didn't just formalized it like last year where we said, okay, let's. you know, make our own run club,

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: Very much like focus on like our Tuesday track sessions.

And what we do is we always get together, we, , run two laps as a warmup, as a group. That's usually our like chit chat and like, you know, kind of catch up time. and then we all gather together either at the side of the track or the field and we'll do like, Some run drills together, you know, to, you know, some, some dynamic [00:50:00] stretching, some A skips, some B skips.

Like, you know, when we first started we didn't really know what we were doing, but part of this is like, well, something's better

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: I think if we were just on our own, we would. Never do any

Ally: I know. I was just thinking that. I was like, I need that in my life. Somebody,

Keegan: do any, any, any sort of skips.

Ally: Yeah. I.

Keegan: But we, so as a group, we'll warm up together. Then we'll do like some run drills and then we'll do some strides, and then we'll like do whatever workout each other. We, we used to do the same workouts, but then as like folks are on different parts of their training schedule and plans, we sort of just broke out into like, all right, we'll just do. Uh, whatever workouts like folks have, and sometimes they're like, oh, maybe I'll join somebody else's workout and so forth. Right? But the whole point is we start together, we're there together as you know, as a group. and then we usually end around the same time. Then we'll like hang out a little bit, you know, take a photo and then we'll start off, start our day, you know. so, so that's where like the Tuesday, group. Uh, start how it started. it's myself, uh, my friend [00:51:00] Kim, my friend Conrad. We all co-founded it. yeah, we, the first year we were, you know, been going strong. We're consistently showing up on Tuesdays. When, when it gets cold or like the track gets

Ally: Right?

Keegan: We'll punt or we'll skip,

Ally: Mm-hmm.

Keegan: Um, but we don't take ourselves too seriously. If we miss a day, we miss a day. Or if we have a big race, like Shamrock Shuffle for example, we won't meet on the track the next Tuesday. We'll go to one of our favorite like coffee and empanada place and we'll hang out there

Ally: There you go. Yeah.

Keegan: we don't think I tell too seriously.

I think the way we look at it is like. We're all, we're all adults. Uh, most of us don't have like a, a track or a cross country background, but it's a chance to really just like put the message out there that like, speed work is for everyone. Like,

Ally: Hmm.

Keegan: Yes, you, the track may be scary if you've never done it before, but. if you create a welcoming environment, then, and, you know, we're open to questions, right? Like, when I first started, I, I didn't even know, like the track was 400 meters. I had to [00:52:00] look that

Ally: Right. Yeah.

Keegan: What is 400 meters in

Ally: Right. Yeah.

Keegan: And so, so it's really, it really started off with our, our Tuesday meetups in the morning.

And then, occasionally, we'll, as the season goes on, we'll. We usually meet up on Saturdays for long runs too. but then again, little more ad hoc, also recognizing everybody had different plans and different mileage. But

Ally: Yep.

Keegan: If nothing else, we start together.

Ally: Yep.

Keegan: then, uh, if timing works out well, we'll meet up at a coffee shop

Ally: I love that. Yeah. I, I did track for one season in high school, so it barely counts. And then when I finally started working with a running coach, there would be workouts where Coach Rachel, there would be workouts that made sense to do on a track. And so I've got, I've told this story recently.

I got, I've gotten kicked off of my daughter's school track multiple times because I don't go at 5 45. I like try to go in the morning and they're like, no, you can't be here while school's in session. I'm like, but I'm a mom. Like, what? Why do you care? but I get it. Okay. [00:53:00] So yeah, that's really fun to have that team-like environment, especially on the track, which can be scary and intimidating for sure.

Yeah.

Keegan: Yeah. And, and the, the fun part of it too is again, everybody may have different workouts because you're on a track.

Ally: Mm-hmm.

Keegan: still see everybody else,

Ally: Right.

Keegan: pass you, you pass them, you're like cheering each

Ally: Yes.

Keegan: They could be in a work interval while you're in a recovery job or vice versa, right? so, so that's, that's been fun, you know? Whereas like, like if you're doing speed work on the road, it's kinda like maybe you start together, but you may not

Ally: exactly.

Keegan: the

Ally: Right, right. Yes. Yeah, it makes complete sense. Are you, I mean, again, because there's so many clubs in Chicago, are you part of any other clubs too, like where you do your long runs with a different club or how's that work?

Keegan: , I try my best to, to jump around and like whenever timing permits. you know, obviously is a club that, you know, we, we try, I try to do my Saturday long runs with, as well as my Tuesday track [00:54:00] works. But, depending on the other days, if timing permits, I'll try to join other clubs that are close by, and I think that's the other thing about the Chicago running community is I've always found like. I can always just pop in even if I don't know anybody. And, uh, everybody has either like a, a Strava event page or like an Instagram page. And sometimes I'll go and just ask like, Hey, like, how many miles are you guys doing?

Um, you know, roughly what pace.

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: I, so I know what I'm getting myself into, right? And, and, and that's the thing. I think like it's, you know, for folks who are like intimidated by like joining run clubs, I, I always tell folks it's always okay to like reach out and ask

Ally: Yes.

Keegan: and, and, and make sure you actually do ask, because everybody's gonna tell you. All are welcome, please

Ally: Mm-hmm.

Keegan: But you also wanna make sure you understand like what you're getting yourself

Ally: Yes.

Keegan: Are they doing five miles? You know, are they doing three? Um, what are their pace ranges? And it's okay to like find a club that okay, like maybe a little too fast with me and, and that's

Ally: Yes.

Keegan: know? but if you don't ask, then I think [00:55:00] sometimes you get in a position where like. may not feel welcome, even though that's not the

Ally: Yes. Right. Absolutely. I know I think about that a lot. As I have a group of women, uh, including Coach Rachel that I run with usually Friday mornings we get together and it's usually whatever Rachel's scheduled for me, I'll do usually, or, and then ask them if they wanna join me in that.

And, you know, we've had other people join us occasionally, and it is like making sure you set the expectations so you don't want anybody, you know, to feel left out or like they, you know, aren't welcome because truly anybody's welcome. And it's just, we happen to run at a weird time for people who have quote unquote normal jobs.

Right. We just, most people can't run at 9:00 AM on a Friday morning. So, but that's been really fun. I can't, oh,

Keegan: I think that just to, you know, close out about run clubs in Chicago, I also think the investment that you put in, like just meeting friends and meeting others and joining as many clubs as you, you can, like, for me, I found that it pays dividends, right?

In a sense of like. running the Chicago Marathon and I'm seeing [00:56:00] like run close to their cheer zones. I recognize them, they recognize me, you know, like you folks are cheering for each

Ally: Right?

Keegan: so it really feel, makes you feel like you're a part of something, you know? so yeah, to the extent my schedule allows.

I try to join, different groups. If I, if I, if I can.

Ally: Yeah, I, I've had a couple people on this podcast from Chicago, one, I can't remember what club he's part of. The other one is, um. Three, run two. My friend Betsy is part of three, run two. Um,

Keegan: yeah,

Ally: so I've seen that club. I I've had the opportunity to run on the Lakeshore quite a bit because I've been to Chicago quite a bit.

the Lakeshore path is just so special. where do you typically do your long runs? I, I don't know exactly what part of the city you're in.

Keegan: Yeah, I'm in, I'm an area called Logan Square.

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: Actually like, two blocks away from where Tree Run two does their Thursday night runs. So sometimes I join

Ally: Nice.

Keegan: If my daughters don't have any activities, you know,

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: uh, I've also had one time where they had a hour and a half volleyball practice and I was like, oh, maybe I'll

Ally: [00:57:00] yeah. There you go.

Keegan: know? so, very blessed in Chicago. There are a lot of running paths. I live really next to an area called the 6 0 6, which used to be at. old train, track, elevated train

Ally: Oh, cool.

Keegan: That they converted into a park. so it's one long stretch at 2.7 miles, elevated that you can just run, there's a bike path and a run path, right? so sometimes that's, that's easy for me. I just hop on, it's like on half a block, half a mile from there. and I've also done long runs on there, back and

Ally: Yeah, I was gonna say, that'd be kind of hard, but

Keegan: it's

Ally: yeah.

Keegan: kind of hard, but sometimes for the convenience, you know, and timing

Ally: Yeah. Put your water where you want it and put your fuel where you want it and come back. Yeah.

Keegan: Exactly. And come back.

and then there's also a couple of public tracks in Chicago that you know, that's part of the city property that you can just show up during the

Ally: That's nice. Yeah,

Keegan: kicked out, you

Ally: I need that.

Keegan: that's nice. and then obviously the lakefront, usually on Saturdays I'll, I'll make a trek out

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: just 'cause it's, a, a habit just 'cause that's where we meet.

And also like so many folks running out

Ally: Yes.

Keegan: friends while you're

Ally: Oh my gosh. [00:58:00] Yeah. Yeah. The most recent time I was out there, there were multiple tents for run clubs and there was some sort of race like 5K happening at the same time. So it's just, there's always something happening and it's really fun to be able to see so many people.

Keegan: Speaking of tents, um, there is Kara, which is Chicago

Ally: the one.

Keegan: Run Association. true winter and summer. they set up like hydration stations for the running

Ally: Yeah. Okay.

Keegan: it's not just for Kara members. anybody running, you know, you every two miles or so, there's like a tent with water and like Gatorade, so.

It kind of spoiled in a way,

Ally: So nice. Yeah.

Keegan: Water. there's city fountains and then there're the keratins, you know? So, so yeah.

Ally: Yeah. Yeah, that's one of, I do remember seeing a keratin in particular. Yeah. It's really cool. okay. The other topic I wanted to cover with you, Keegan, is content creation. So we talked a little bit about it, kind of with Brooks. but I, I just love it. I love watching your content. It's always so [00:59:00] lighthearted fun, but also inspiring.

And, so I'm just curious about how you approach that and, and also how you've come to work with brands like shocks and, and others. yeah. I just think it's so interesting.

Keegan: Honestly, I, I'm still learning, still trying to get better at it. I think when I first started, uh, you know, spending more time on Instagram, like I was mostly just posting about my own training journey. and then when I started joining more run clubs, I think I, created more content around like, my experience, joining round clubs and being there and like part of the community, right. so that's kind of how I started. and I have to credit Brooks for like, giving me the opportunity. 'cause I would say like, I went into it not knowing what I was doing or what I was gonna do, but just being surrounded by like other creative folks who are also doing stuff. it helped you hone your craft,

Ally: Yes.

Keegan: and folks are always willing to like, collaborate on like, you know, whether it's silly reels or serious reels, right? So, so that's really how it started and I still think that's like the ethos of what I do today. If I feel inspired, I like want to [01:00:00] make something that's fun or lighthearted or just like put some humor out there, I will, right?

And, um, I, again, don't take myself too, too seriously. and it goes up and flows. There are times when I'm like, I feel just creatively ca

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: But I won't make as many videos. Probably might still post about just my, my training journey, et cetera. Right. but I also see it as an outlet.

So if I creatively tap and I can't get to it, then. like, okay, like I got to make some adjustments elsewhere, otherwise, like, you know, I'm missing that outlet.

so, so that's, that's the way I, I approach like, you know, my content creation. and then, been fortunate as again, not start this out with a plan of some major

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: And things like that. Right. but then as I started making more content every so often, like some brands will reach out and like, in exchange for like product and, initially I'd be like, okay, I'll do it. but then I've been got them a more picky about, okay, well if I only really wanna do it if I'm.

Passionate

Ally: Yes.[01:01:00]

Keegan: The, the product or something I'm willing

Ally: Mm-hmm.

Keegan: Right? and so, so that's, so really when I first started I was like, okay, I'm just, you know, spent most of my time with just Brooks, right? but now that that has ended, I, you know, kind of open myself up every time I see an opportunity to apply for an ambassador. Take a look and I'll apply. so that's how I got the shocks one too.

Ally: Nice.

Keegan: Applied to it. and, and some, some programs are more like higher touch, some are lower

Ally: Mm-hmm.

Keegan: shocks doesn't ask too much, you know. and they also do a good job in like, you know, as they have bibs, they do share with their like

Ally: Yeah.

That's great.

Keegan: how, how, which is how I got into the, uh, the cherry

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: uh, 10 miler, uh, in two weeks. but, I think that's, that's, uh, the, the way I approach it, I try not to take on too much too. I just don't wanna put myself, I just don't wanna create for the sake of

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: but really it's a creative outlet.

Ally: Yeah, it's so fun. one of the videos we did together did really well. The one one where it was like running the, running backwards to run forward. It was really [01:02:00] funny.

Keegan: That was so funny. Yeah, that was

Ally: Oh, I love doing that. In fact, you know, it's, it's nice to have other people who do it, who get it, who like to collaborate. Um, I, I've been wanting to get more people here locally to when we meet up, do stuff because it's, it's, it can be lonely when you're just creating stuff by yourself. I really love creating with others, I think is where I find the most joy.

But yeah, it's so fun,

Keegan: I think that's where I, um, a like-minded individual thing, right? Like whenever I go for like a travel race and like there are like Brooks friends there, it's almost like, oh yeah, they get it, we get it. Like, let's do

Ally: right?

Keegan: you

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: but other, otherwise I'm sometimes have to like coerce some my friends.

Okay. Can we, I just need you for like 10 seconds.

Ally: My. My Friday morning. My Friday morning, women, they are such good sports. 'cause none of them really like, wanna be in front of the camera necessarily. And they'll just humor me. I'll be like, okay, here's what I want you to do. I want you to just jump, just jump in the air.

Keegan: Yeah.

Ally: And they'll be like, how, how high ally?

How [01:03:00] high do you want us to jump? Yeah. Yeah. It's fun.

Keegan: Great

Ally: Great friends. We all need 'em. Yeah. Um, yeah, so DC I actually, speaking of BRC, Lena was out in DC for the Rock and Roll half marathon that I just did.

Keegan: yeah. Yeah,

Ally: I didn't get to see her sadly, but it was another one of those where, you know, she used to live in Indianapolis.

she got on my radar because of you guys, because of, Brook's running collective really.

Keegan: Yeah, yeah,

Ally: and then

Keegan: you guys had met in during her Indy

Ally: I know, not that I remember, so yeah, so it's kind of cool just how the internet brings so many people together. But yeah, DC you get to go run. And see all the cherry blossoms. It looks, I mean, ugh.

So much fun.

Keegan: I'm, I'm so excited. I, uh, it, it fits in nicely with just, uh, the, you know, the, the train cycle for the, in the mini, which I guess at this point, four weeks-ish,

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: but I don't know what I'm doing yet. I haven't decided if I'm like, just gonna run it for fun and just get the miles or do a workout in the middle, or. Secretly trying to see if [01:04:00] I can recruit somebody to run with

Ally: There you go.

Keegan: Again, Yeah. So, so that would be, that would be ideal. But I haven't, um, I've got some friends in, the DC area, again through the running

Ally: that's nice.

Keegan: Worldwide. They're based in Virginia.

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: And, they've come to Chicago a couple times and we've hung out. but I haven't been to their home turf yet, so I'm looking forward to going out there, seeing them, you know, so,

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: But yeah, that's, uh, gonna be a, a nice little running weekend.

Ally: It will be. So I, I don't know anything about the course. Have you looked at the course or any have studied that? No. Yeah.

Keegan: not, no.

Ally: Yeah. I wonder, it's gotta be by obviously the national mall where, you see all the pictures of the cherry blossoms, but I wonder what that looks like compared to, you know, now I've done rock and roll DC and I've done Marine Corps and so now I'm like, okay, all these DC races are pretty amazing really where you get to run.

Keegan: That's why I assumed you had done it already. 'cause I knew you've done those too, you

Ally: I know that's the last one.

Keegan: I know is it starts, yeah. All I know it starts by the [01:05:00] Washington

Ally: Okay.

Keegan: I dunno, too

Ally: Yeah, that makes sense. Well, I can't wait to see the pictures and videos from that race and hear about that experience. that's gonna be really fun. We actually, in Indianapolis that weekend have our 10 miler for the mini marathon training series that we have here. So it is funny how well that works into your training schedule

Keegan: Yeah.

Ally: the fact that it's 10 miles instead of a half marathon is perfect.

Keegan: Well, we'll both be, uh, running 10 milers in

Ally: We will, mine will be a little less, little less, uh, picturesque, but really, you know, Indy, we've got a couple cherry blossom trees around downtown by our canal, so maybe we'll run over there. I have no idea where we run, so.

Keegan: Yeah,

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: don't, don't sell Indy short,

Ally: know. I was trying, not all of a sudden I caught myself and I'm like, you know, I shouldn't say that because our city is amazing and I really do love running here and love the race scene that we have here.

so I'm gonna, I'm gonna ask you the end of the podcast questions 'cause I do wanna talk about the Indy Mini as part of your next finish line. So, and I only have two questions. The first is,

Keegan: Okay.

Ally: Is your [01:06:00] favorite running mantra and or song?

Keegan: uh, I don't know about mantras. I think I cycled through a bunch of 'em. Um, lately I've been, half marathon training, running a lot of thresholds. I've been telling myself to get comfy with the un uncomfy, you know, um, that, that's the mantra I've used. I've been. Using a lot in my workouts, in terms of favorite song I've been listening to a lot of Lord lately.

And, uh, super Cut in particular, like, really gets me going. me into a nice, like steady pace.

Ally: Yeah. Yeah, that's fun.

Keegan: Yeah.

Ally: then next finish line or milestone. Now, we kind of already talked about the finish lines that are coming up.

Keegan: Yeah. so Indy Mini is, uh. My, a race for the year. I have not told anybody my goals. I've not put it out out there. but Chasing some scary goals. the history behind it is, as I mentioned, my goals was trying to run a bit more fans this year. My friend Caroline and I, also a former Brooks Ambassador, actually we're both shots ambassadors now. we've been talking about wanting to run a race together for a while [01:07:00] now for several years, and. knowing last year I was pretty tied up with marathon training and she had her own goals. this year we're like, okay, let's find a half marathon. And we picked a couple, bounced around a couple in Chicago as well.

She was willing to travel. She's based in Dallas. and then Indy Mini came up and I was like, what about this one? We'll make Mini travel for both of us. Right? and so, so we if you

Ally: Yeah,

Keegan: she was trying to chase a, a 1 40, 1 42. and, and that's, that's about 10 minutes faster than my half pr. And so I'm like, okay. And she's like, and I believe you can do it too.

So I'm like, all right, let me go talk to my coach Aubrey, and let's start

Ally: yeah, yeah.

Keegan: So, so we'll see. My, my goal is to, uh, do

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: keep up with her. but yeah, the, the plan is. I get myself, myself in a really good shape and, see, uh, see how it goes, you know, and, uh, have fun, obviously, once and foremost.

And, so looking forward to it. I think it'll be, we've been in races together, but this would be our first race, I think, where we plan to like run, run together,

Ally: It'll be fun. Well, I'm running [01:08:00] with Ainsley's Angels, so I'll be pushing,

Keegan: Yeah.

Ally: my, one of my favorite parts about doing that is that we start the race and then everybody else comes behind us, right? And so if you're, if you're running, faster, the pace, usually faster pace than like a little bit under two hours, then you'll pass us, which is so fun to be able to cheer on all my friends that run by me.

So hopefully that means I'll get to see you as you fly by.

Keegan: I will be looking out for you on course for

Ally: Yeah.

Keegan: Uh, and I'll see you the night before too.

Ally: I know that's okay. Perfect. Because you're staying at the Bottleworks Hotel, which is where Lindsay Hein and I host our events and Yep. We're doing an event the Friday before, um, it's mid-afternoon now. We had to adjust based on some of our pro athletes schedules, but we have Emma Grace Hurley joining us just,

Keegan: yeah,

Ally: just Dina.

Yeah, she just won.

Keegan: Shamrock Shuffle

Ally: Exactly. So what a perfect tie in there. So yeah, so she is just wonderful. I'm really excited for, for that and to see you [01:09:00] in person again. It'll be great.

Keegan: Yeah. Yeah, both Caroline and I had both, both got tickets, so we'll both be

Ally: Oh, perfect. Yay.

Keegan: Yeah.

Ally: Well I can't wait. It's almost here, which is crazy. It's like just a little over a month away.

Keegan: That is

Ally: Or no March?

Yeah. Oh my gosh. It is a little over a month. I'm like, wait, what's today? Uh, it'll be great.

Keegan: I'm not ready, but we'll get there.

Ally: Well, I'm gonna be praying for good weather, just in general for everybody. but especially for people who are chasing big goals. 'cause it'll be, it'll be

Keegan: Yeah.

Ally: to have a great day. So, well thank you Keegan, so much for doing this with me.

It was so fun to get to know you better.

Keegan: No, absolutely. Yeah. Thanks so much for the opportunity. Like great chat, great conversation.

Ally: And thanks to everybody who listened and happy running.

If you enjoyed this episode of Finish Lines and Milestones from Sandy Boy Productions, head to the show notes and go sign up for Finish Lines and Milestones weekly newsletter written by me. I try to make it not suck, that would be the best way to support me in the show. If you already do that, you know the drill share rate, review, whatever else you can do.

To spread the word would be much appreciated. Wanted to [01:10:00] note that Whitney Hines, who is the host of the Mother Runners Podcast, who you heard about in the middle of this episode, will be running the Carmel Marathon. So check out her podcast, get to know her so that we can cheer her on when she is here locally in Carmel.

Get your tickets to the Indy Mini event and oh, I also wanted to let you know that catching up with Coach for April's edition will be recorded next week. We had some scheduling issues, given spring break and everything else happening.

So that episode will come out next Wednesday, April 15th, with myself and my coach, Rachel Senders, if you wanna hear a little bit about my personal running journey. Alright, talk to you again next week. Bye.

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